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Wasn't he though? In hindsight this still seems like a better deal as opposed to what actually happened.

by t0 14y ago

niggler 14y ago
Never having been through a similar situation, I cannot say what I would do if I were in his shoes. I believe that he didn't believe that what he did warranted decades of jail time. I believe that the prosecutor believed that his crimes did justify jail time. But your statement reflects two facts: that he did end up committing suicide (not known a priori) and that he chose not to accept guilt when he didn't believe he was guilty (and I fully suspect you've never been in that type of situation at the severity of the Swartz case, so it's hard to definitively state that you would just take the jail time)
enraged_camel 14y ago
As others have said, he would also be branded a felon, which in the US is enough to ruin most people's professional careers - not to mention a host of other very strict restrictions.
- signed0 14y ago
  Aaron wasn't most people though, and it's not as if his profession was one that would be ruined by a criminal record.
  - Helianthus 14y ago
    He wasn't most people _because_ he wasn't the sort to submit to such a demeaning choice.
  - enraged_camel 14y ago
    It's not just about profession. Being labeled a felon is a serious pain in the ass and follows you for the rest of your life. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony#United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony#United_States Besides all the restrictions, there's also the stigma attached to it.
    - jlgreco 14y ago
      That housing rental one is huge. Most people forget about that one. It has the potential to seriously effect your quality of life.
      - rdl 14y ago
        In practice he would have been fine.
        jlgreco 14y ago
        I would not be so sure. Stardom fades fast, particularly considering the fandom around him really only kicked it up a notch after he died. Check out the general sentiment of him on HN before he died; most people thought he was whinging. Maybe he could find some people to help him out 5 years from now. Maybe even 10 or 20, but for how long would he be able to rely on that?
        rdl 14y ago
        Enough to not worry about getting someone to rent an apartment to or for him, at least. And expunging a non-violent felony after some period of time isn't that hard.
InclinedPlane 14y ago
Was he? He was never tried, and neither a court nor a jury made a finding either way. The evidence that is publicly available doesn't back up some of the charges against him and at best is ambiguous as to whether his actions would result in even a 3 months prison sentence, if anything, if he had had the chance to have his case heard in court. Especially given that with his earlier work with PACER it's quite likely that his goal with JSTOR was to gain access to and release documents which, legally, should have been in the public domain. Besides which, whether or not he violated the law is only partially relevant as the morality of the law is also at issue. How would you feel if your only option was to plead guilty to a law you felt was unjust?

Wasn't he though? In hindsight this still seems like a better deal as opposed to what actually happened.

by t0 14y ago

Wasn't he though? In hindsight this still seems like a better deal as opposed to what actually happened.

Never having been through a similar situation, I cannot say what I would do if I were in his shoes. I believe that he didn't believe that what he did warranted decades of jail time. I believe that the prosecutor believed that his crimes did justify jail time. But your statement reflects two facts: that he did end up committing suicide (not known a priori) and that he chose not to accept guilt when he didn't believe he was guilty (and I fully suspect you've never been in that type of situation at the severity of the Swartz case, so it's hard to definitively state that you would just take the jail time)

enraged_camel 14y ago

As others have said, he would also be branded a felon, which in the US is enough to ruin most people's professional careers - not to mention a host of other very strict restrictions.

signed0 14y ago
Aaron wasn't most people though, and it's not as if his profession was one that would be ruined by a criminal record.
- Helianthus 14y ago
  He wasn't most people _because_ he wasn't the sort to submit to such a demeaning choice.
- enraged_camel 14y ago
  It's not just about profession. Being labeled a felon is a serious pain in the ass and follows you for the rest of your life. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony#United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony#United_States Besides all the restrictions, there's also the stigma attached to it.
  - jlgreco 14y ago
    That housing rental one is huge. Most people forget about that one. It has the potential to seriously effect your quality of life.
    - rdl 14y ago
      In practice he would have been fine.
      - jlgreco 14y ago
        I would not be so sure. Stardom fades fast, particularly considering the fandom around him really only kicked it up a notch after he died. Check out the general sentiment of him on HN before he died; most people thought he was whinging. Maybe he could find some people to help him out 5 years from now. Maybe even 10 or 20, but for how long would he be able to rely on that?
        rdl 14y ago
        Enough to not worry about getting someone to rent an apartment to or for him, at least. And expunging a non-violent felony after some period of time isn't that hard.

InclinedPlane 14y ago

Was he? He was never tried, and neither a court nor a jury made a finding either way. The evidence that is publicly available doesn't back up some of the charges against him and at best is ambiguous as to whether his actions would result in even a 3 months prison sentence, if anything, if he had had the chance to have his case heard in court. Especially given that with his earlier work with PACER it's quite likely that his goal with JSTOR was to gain access to and release documents which, legally, should have been in the public domain. Besides which, whether or not he violated the law is only partially relevant as the morality of the law is also at issue. How would you feel if your only option was to plead guilty to a law you felt was unjust?