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It seems absurd but I'm going to have to side with the state/library on this one. It can literally cost more to make a choice to use the cheaper unit than to ju

It seems absurd but I'm going to have to side with the state/library on this one. It can literally cost more to make a choice to use the cheaper unit than to just buy the big one. "Some libraries need smaller routers. Ok. Which ones?" could easily run in the millions before any routers were purchased. Unfortunately, that's just the nature of government purchasing.

jessaustin 14y ago
This is bullshit. They could have put the network engineer from the Department (the guy who confirmed he had not requested dual power supplies) on this for a week, and he would have had a solid estimate for far less. Put him on it a month and he could have had an itemized order with the exact models to order from Cisco or from any of its competitors. If he were busy with other duties, any other network engineer in the state's employ could have done the same. If they were all too busy, a consultant could have been hired on for a month's engagement at two to three times the FTE cost.
- damian2000 14y ago
  Agreed - it sounded like the Cisco guy just spec'd up the absolute maximum needed for one or two locations, then just decided to roll out the same spec across all 1000+ locations, obviously trying to maximise sales. Cisco was probably shocked when the government approved it all.
  - prawn 14y ago
    "Cisco was probably shocked when the government approved it all." Wouldn't that imply they hadn't succeeded with the same ploy before? I think that's unlikely!
  - intended 14y ago
    I saw it differently. To me this looks like a situation where something was said verbally, and then no confirmation or follow up was given. Wanting to get the quote out, Cisco just made it and sent it. They assumed that it, and any other issues, would get sorted out when the quote got reviewed. The client slept. Cisco said "Good job sales team". It is always the job of the buyer to know what he is getting, for what he is paying.
- noonespecial 14y ago
  Oh how I wish it worked like that. And who knows, perhaps out in WV it can. But I was once an appointed advisor (one of three) to a committee that was in charge of reviewing the qualifications of a similar outside consultant and making a short term contract recommendation to the department that would approve the hiring. I'm here to tell you...
  - jessaustin 14y ago
    Don't leave us hanging! b^) I suppose when I say, "they could have" I mean that some appropriately-empowered decision maker who had an interest in making the right decision could have either assigned his own network engineers to do the work, or could have assigned such an engineer to hire someone else to do the work. I probably shouldn't assume that such a decision maker does exist.
pmorici 14y ago
That's nonsense the article shows pretty convincing evidence that even the largest IT department in the state, the state legislature, didn't need equipment this powerful. Even if they did want to standardize on one device across the state to gain administrative efficiency they should have picked something cheaper.
cyrus_ 14y ago
But "some libraries need bigger routers. Ok. which ones?" would cost much less (especially given that the answer would have been none of them.)
sfall 14y ago
they could have used a population list to figure out that a voip server for a library that can handle as many voip lines as 50% of the residents of the town.
spikels 14y ago
Great - justify incompetence with lazy reasoning. Why bother figuring out what each library needs just assume they are all as big as the largest public library. I though I was cynical but if this it truly "the nature of government purchasing" I am clearly not nearly cynical enough. Q: Wouldn't the internet service provider be willing to throw in a router for free? I got one with my $20/month service. I bet these libraries are paying a bit more than me.

jessaustin 14y ago

This is bullshit. They could have put the network engineer from the Department (the guy who confirmed he had not requested dual power supplies) on this for a week, and he would have had a solid estimate for far less. Put him on it a month and he could have had an itemized order with the exact models to order from Cisco or from any of its competitors. If he were busy with other duties, any other network engineer in the state's employ could have done the same. If they were all too busy, a consultant could have been hired on for a month's engagement at two to three times the FTE cost.

damian2000 14y ago
Agreed - it sounded like the Cisco guy just spec'd up the absolute maximum needed for one or two locations, then just decided to roll out the same spec across all 1000+ locations, obviously trying to maximise sales. Cisco was probably shocked when the government approved it all.
- prawn 14y ago
  "Cisco was probably shocked when the government approved it all." Wouldn't that imply they hadn't succeeded with the same ploy before? I think that's unlikely!
- intended 14y ago
  I saw it differently. To me this looks like a situation where something was said verbally, and then no confirmation or follow up was given. Wanting to get the quote out, Cisco just made it and sent it. They assumed that it, and any other issues, would get sorted out when the quote got reviewed. The client slept. Cisco said "Good job sales team". It is always the job of the buyer to know what he is getting, for what he is paying.
noonespecial 14y ago
Oh how I wish it worked like that. And who knows, perhaps out in WV it can. But I was once an appointed advisor (one of three) to a committee that was in charge of reviewing the qualifications of a similar outside consultant and making a short term contract recommendation to the department that would approve the hiring. I'm here to tell you...
- jessaustin 14y ago
  Don't leave us hanging! b^) I suppose when I say, "they could have" I mean that some appropriately-empowered decision maker who had an interest in making the right decision could have either assigned his own network engineers to do the work, or could have assigned such an engineer to hire someone else to do the work. I probably shouldn't assume that such a decision maker does exist.

pmorici 14y ago

That's nonsense the article shows pretty convincing evidence that even the largest IT department in the state, the state legislature, didn't need equipment this powerful. Even if they did want to standardize on one device across the state to gain administrative efficiency they should have picked something cheaper.

cyrus_ 14y ago

But "some libraries need bigger routers. Ok. which ones?" would cost much less (especially given that the answer would have been none of them.)

sfall 14y ago

they could have used a population list to figure out that a voip server for a library that can handle as many voip lines as 50% of the residents of the town.

spikels 14y ago

Great - justify incompetence with lazy reasoning. Why bother figuring out what each library needs just assume they are all as big as the largest public library. I though I was cynical but if this it truly "the nature of government purchasing" I am clearly not nearly cynical enough. Q: Wouldn't the internet service provider be willing to throw in a router for free? I got one with my $20/month service. I bet these libraries are paying a bit more than me.