5 ms·

"I just want to say as an American, I am so fed up with all these gun stories." Me too. But it won't end soon. Currently every shooting in every city is a can

"I just want to say as an American, I am so fed up with all these gun stories." Me too. But it won't end soon. Currently every shooting in every city is a candidate for promotion to a national media campaign that is focused on gaining additional restrictions on firearms, especially at the federal level (but also state level: Colorado is at this moment passing new highly-restrictive state firearms laws). Every opportunity to alarm the citizenry about firearms, every chance to get parents' blood-pressure up with false or real reports of gunmen afoot will be invoked by the media. It's both good for their business and it's good for their political agenda. In essence, this is an orchestrated attempt to use the Newtown shootings and the subsequent heightened public sensitivity as leverage to advance a long-present liberal goal to register and confiscate all firearms.

flexie 14y ago
"In essence, this is an orchestrated attempt to use the Newtown shootings and the subsequent heightened public sensitivity..." Oh please. Who orchestrated that? The media got together? The government? There is nothing odd in requiring safety from other people's activities, whether that's their their reckless driving or their gun fetish.
- damoncali 14y ago
  It's not like it's a hidden conspiracy. Gun control activists have explicitly stated that they need to take advantage of the emotion following the shootings to push their agenda. And yes, the goal of many of them (including the author of the assault weapons ban currently proposed) is confiscation. She said it herself.
  - reader5000 14y ago
    Yeah it's totally irrational to seek the most obvious way to prevent recurrence of the shooting massacre of 20 children, which happens with a marked regularity. Only a New World Order could explain why people want to ban guns.
    - damoncali 14y ago
      The snark is unnecessary. Gun control advocates have had these goals for decades - long before Newtown - and openly speak about them. There is no tinfoil hat, no new world order. Just a political agenda by a minority of the political spectrum that uses tragedy to their advantage without apology.
      - reader5000 14y ago
        That still doesnt make any sense. It's like say in nuclear energy. There are two camps: one side says it is safe the other says it isn't. However, if evidence of more and more nuclear tragedies accumulate, one side looks more and more correct than the other. That side isn't "using" a nuclear tragedy to "further their own agenda", they are simply using it to demonstrate they are correct.
        damoncali 14y ago
        I'm just responding to the claims that there is an orchestrated attempt to use Newtown emotion to further gun control and confiscation. There undeniably is, and it's not some crazy notion of the tinfoil hat crowd - but the admitted and public goals of some people in power. They have stated that they need to act now or they will lose the emotion required to pass such laws. That is not demonstrating that they are correct - it's the equivalent of "act before we have time to calm down and think, because we know we are in the minority on this."
        Turing_Machine 14y ago
        Anti-nuclear hysteria is another good example. Which "tragedies" would those be, by the way?
      - rooshdi 14y ago
        The same can be argued against the NRA: http://www.democracynow.org/2013/1/16/behind_the_nras_money_gun_lobby http://www.democracynow.org/2013/1/16/behind_the_nras_money_...
        14y ago
- nitrogen 14y ago
  "Orchestrated" may be too strong a word; it's like there is emergent, independent behavior from a large minority of people who share the same views and all saw the same opportunity.
  - damoncali 14y ago
    It's really not too strong. From a Brady Campaign press release: https://www.commondreams.org/newswire/2012/12/15-1 https://www.commondreams.org/newswire/2012/12/15-1 "We have to take terrible moments like this and use it as a catalyst to demand the sensible change in our nation that is too long overdue." That was a major talking point for similarly minded groups in the time immediately following the shooting.
- Shivetya 14y ago
  The media does tend to sensationalize it, and yes certain people in government exploit it for personal gain. I look at it this way, just be glad they can sensationalize it, the alternative would be that this is so routine it doesn't make people think. America does not have a gun problem; it has a cultural problem that many refuse to recognize. The look to ban the tool employed by this culture but not to find how to end this culture. Ever listen to the music on the streets? Ever listen to the talk in a down town truly urban mall area? We spend more time coddling and telling them its not their fault than focusing on getting them productive and responsible. People who are told over and over they are not responsible tend to become just that.
jackalope 14y ago
No. As a society, we became numb to gun violence to the point where the media stopped reporting it on the news. The Newtown shootings reminded us that the problem is real and pervasive enough that it demands a solution. Stories of gun violence are rightly reassuming a place at the top of the hour because of the horrible, devastating tragedies that they are. This isn't about a liberal agenda in conflict with a conservative conspiracy. I fully believe in and support the 2nd amendment, and strongly feel that any new legislation must comply with it. But this right comes with responsibility. You don't get to shoot through your door because someone turned the knob without ringing your doorbell and hide behind it being an act of self-defense. You don't get to prove your bravery by firing into a group of innocent students from a rival high school. You don't take psychologically troubled individuals to the firing range for therapy and teach them to be efficient killing machines. And if you own guns, you don't leave them on the kitchen table so your seven-year-old can grab it on his way to school for show-and-tell. This isn't political. We need to shame the idiots who abuse their rights to the detriment of the rights of others. We need to express a sense of outrage when this happens, loud enough for our families and friends to hear it. If that means a continuous stream of these stories on the news, stories of actual life-changing events, is what it takes, then so be it. It's about time the media did its job and reported real news instead of tie-ins to the latest blockbuster the parent company just released.
- jbooth 14y ago
  Yeah, the amazing thing about this gun debate is that, given the drug war, I'm all prepared to punt on prohibition of anything not being worth it... And then I listen to your average pro-gun advocate. Holy shit. Ok, I want everyone except for the average pro-gun advocate to be able to buy a gun.
  - mindcrime 14y ago
    I expect the people you're referring to are anything but average pro-gun advocates. I (a staunch pro-gun advocate) interact with a lot of gun owners and "pro gun people". And I can say that the vast majority are calm, reasonable, level-headed and logical. Certainly as much so, if not more so, than the rabid anti-gunners. They also tend to be better informed in my experience. Are there some really kooky people out there on the pro-gun side? Yeah, and a lot of them are very vocal about their weird conspiracy theories, their racist tendencies, etc. But those people are hardly representative of gun owners in general.
Yver 14y ago
> orchestrated attempt to [...] confiscate all firearms Are there people out there who can read this and not think that this person is mental? I can't see a difference between this conspiracy theory and all the others: chemtrails, fluoride, mind control, FEMA camps, Time Cube.
- damoncali 14y ago
  It's not a conspiracy. It is the stated goal of politicians who are currently in office. I think the strong language of the parent is throwing you off what he actually said. Feinstein in her own words: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffI-tWh37UY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffI-tWh37UY
- reader5000 14y ago
  I mean, fluoride does reduce IQ in children: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/ http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens...
Tangaroa 14y ago
True, there was no national dialogue on guns until the Democratic Party-controlled press fabricated one. The Newton shooting was going to be another crime story to be largely forgotten in a month except that the Democratic press made it the top headline of every party-run newspaper for over a week. (Meanwhile, where the hell are the news articles about Benghazi and the second September 11 attacks? Our "nearly defeated" wartime enemy launches simultaneous attacks on dozens of US facilities around the world, with tens of thousands of fresh recruits, and there is NO news coverage? WTF?) It is a classic "pseudo-event" as Boorstin called them, or in common parlance, a fake news story. It is obvious that the Democrats are using their near-monopoly power over the media to create the image of a public frenzy where there was none, for the purpose of raising enough public support through the bandwagon effect to shoot another hole in the Constitution. They are doing this partly by slandering the Constitution's supporters as "gun nuts" and potential murderers. Imagine if the political cartoons in your newspaper regularly portrayed EFF and online free-speech activists as child rapists, kidnappers in bondage gear dragging screaming little girls away, because a few people use Tor and Linux for trading kiddy porn. That is how the Democratic Party is depicting anyone who believes in the Constitution and the orderly process of law whether they are gun owners or not. This is not intended to be a partisan statement. I am a Democrat. I am also able to see what my party is doing, and I don't like it. This also has nothing to do with Obama; the pressure is coming from the party machine, not the White House. Obama is doing nothing significant, proposing minor regulatory changes that stay within the bounds of the Constitution, while giving the appearance of doing something to appease the party's desire for action.
- reader5000 14y ago
  Yeah dude the gun slaughter of 20 children in an elementary school wasn't even going to make national news until "the Democrats" and their "near-monopoly control of the media" got a hold of it. Good thing there are people like you who can pierce through the bullshit with the Eye of Truth.

flexie 14y ago

"In essence, this is an orchestrated attempt to use the Newtown shootings and the subsequent heightened public sensitivity..." Oh please. Who orchestrated that? The media got together? The government? There is nothing odd in requiring safety from other people's activities, whether that's their their reckless driving or their gun fetish.

damoncali 14y ago
It's not like it's a hidden conspiracy. Gun control activists have explicitly stated that they need to take advantage of the emotion following the shootings to push their agenda. And yes, the goal of many of them (including the author of the assault weapons ban currently proposed) is confiscation. She said it herself.
- reader5000 14y ago
  Yeah it's totally irrational to seek the most obvious way to prevent recurrence of the shooting massacre of 20 children, which happens with a marked regularity. Only a New World Order could explain why people want to ban guns.
  - damoncali 14y ago
    The snark is unnecessary. Gun control advocates have had these goals for decades - long before Newtown - and openly speak about them. There is no tinfoil hat, no new world order. Just a political agenda by a minority of the political spectrum that uses tragedy to their advantage without apology.
    - reader5000 14y ago
      That still doesnt make any sense. It's like say in nuclear energy. There are two camps: one side says it is safe the other says it isn't. However, if evidence of more and more nuclear tragedies accumulate, one side looks more and more correct than the other. That side isn't "using" a nuclear tragedy to "further their own agenda", they are simply using it to demonstrate they are correct.
      - damoncali 14y ago
        I'm just responding to the claims that there is an orchestrated attempt to use Newtown emotion to further gun control and confiscation. There undeniably is, and it's not some crazy notion of the tinfoil hat crowd - but the admitted and public goals of some people in power. They have stated that they need to act now or they will lose the emotion required to pass such laws. That is not demonstrating that they are correct - it's the equivalent of "act before we have time to calm down and think, because we know we are in the minority on this."
      - Turing_Machine 14y ago
        Anti-nuclear hysteria is another good example. Which "tragedies" would those be, by the way?
    - rooshdi 14y ago
      The same can be argued against the NRA: http://www.democracynow.org/2013/1/16/behind_the_nras_money_gun_lobby http://www.democracynow.org/2013/1/16/behind_the_nras_money_...
      - 14y ago
nitrogen 14y ago
"Orchestrated" may be too strong a word; it's like there is emergent, independent behavior from a large minority of people who share the same views and all saw the same opportunity.
- damoncali 14y ago
  It's really not too strong. From a Brady Campaign press release: https://www.commondreams.org/newswire/2012/12/15-1 https://www.commondreams.org/newswire/2012/12/15-1 "We have to take terrible moments like this and use it as a catalyst to demand the sensible change in our nation that is too long overdue." That was a major talking point for similarly minded groups in the time immediately following the shooting.
Shivetya 14y ago
The media does tend to sensationalize it, and yes certain people in government exploit it for personal gain. I look at it this way, just be glad they can sensationalize it, the alternative would be that this is so routine it doesn't make people think. America does not have a gun problem; it has a cultural problem that many refuse to recognize. The look to ban the tool employed by this culture but not to find how to end this culture. Ever listen to the music on the streets? Ever listen to the talk in a down town truly urban mall area? We spend more time coddling and telling them its not their fault than focusing on getting them productive and responsible. People who are told over and over they are not responsible tend to become just that.

jackalope 14y ago

No. As a society, we became numb to gun violence to the point where the media stopped reporting it on the news. The Newtown shootings reminded us that the problem is real and pervasive enough that it demands a solution. Stories of gun violence are rightly reassuming a place at the top of the hour because of the horrible, devastating tragedies that they are. This isn't about a liberal agenda in conflict with a conservative conspiracy. I fully believe in and support the 2nd amendment, and strongly feel that any new legislation must comply with it. But this right comes with responsibility. You don't get to shoot through your door because someone turned the knob without ringing your doorbell and hide behind it being an act of self-defense. You don't get to prove your bravery by firing into a group of innocent students from a rival high school. You don't take psychologically troubled individuals to the firing range for therapy and teach them to be efficient killing machines. And if you own guns, you don't leave them on the kitchen table so your seven-year-old can grab it on his way to school for show-and-tell. This isn't political. We need to shame the idiots who abuse their rights to the detriment of the rights of others. We need to express a sense of outrage when this happens, loud enough for our families and friends to hear it. If that means a continuous stream of these stories on the news, stories of actual life-changing events, is what it takes, then so be it. It's about time the media did its job and reported real news instead of tie-ins to the latest blockbuster the parent company just released.

jbooth 14y ago
Yeah, the amazing thing about this gun debate is that, given the drug war, I'm all prepared to punt on prohibition of anything not being worth it... And then I listen to your average pro-gun advocate. Holy shit. Ok, I want everyone except for the average pro-gun advocate to be able to buy a gun.
- mindcrime 14y ago
  I expect the people you're referring to are anything but average pro-gun advocates. I (a staunch pro-gun advocate) interact with a lot of gun owners and "pro gun people". And I can say that the vast majority are calm, reasonable, level-headed and logical. Certainly as much so, if not more so, than the rabid anti-gunners. They also tend to be better informed in my experience. Are there some really kooky people out there on the pro-gun side? Yeah, and a lot of them are very vocal about their weird conspiracy theories, their racist tendencies, etc. But those people are hardly representative of gun owners in general.

Yver 14y ago

> orchestrated attempt to [...] confiscate all firearms Are there people out there who can read this and not think that this person is mental? I can't see a difference between this conspiracy theory and all the others: chemtrails, fluoride, mind control, FEMA camps, Time Cube.

damoncali 14y ago
It's not a conspiracy. It is the stated goal of politicians who are currently in office. I think the strong language of the parent is throwing you off what he actually said. Feinstein in her own words: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffI-tWh37UY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffI-tWh37UY
reader5000 14y ago
I mean, fluoride does reduce IQ in children: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/ http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens...

Tangaroa 14y ago

True, there was no national dialogue on guns until the Democratic Party-controlled press fabricated one. The Newton shooting was going to be another crime story to be largely forgotten in a month except that the Democratic press made it the top headline of every party-run newspaper for over a week. (Meanwhile, where the hell are the news articles about Benghazi and the second September 11 attacks? Our "nearly defeated" wartime enemy launches simultaneous attacks on dozens of US facilities around the world, with tens of thousands of fresh recruits, and there is NO news coverage? WTF?) It is a classic "pseudo-event" as Boorstin called them, or in common parlance, a fake news story. It is obvious that the Democrats are using their near-monopoly power over the media to create the image of a public frenzy where there was none, for the purpose of raising enough public support through the bandwagon effect to shoot another hole in the Constitution. They are doing this partly by slandering the Constitution's supporters as "gun nuts" and potential murderers. Imagine if the political cartoons in your newspaper regularly portrayed EFF and online free-speech activists as child rapists, kidnappers in bondage gear dragging screaming little girls away, because a few people use Tor and Linux for trading kiddy porn. That is how the Democratic Party is depicting anyone who believes in the Constitution and the orderly process of law whether they are gun owners or not. This is not intended to be a partisan statement. I am a Democrat. I am also able to see what my party is doing, and I don't like it. This also has nothing to do with Obama; the pressure is coming from the party machine, not the White House. Obama is doing nothing significant, proposing minor regulatory changes that stay within the bounds of the Constitution, while giving the appearance of doing something to appease the party's desire for action.

reader5000 14y ago
Yeah dude the gun slaughter of 20 children in an elementary school wasn't even going to make national news until "the Democrats" and their "near-monopoly control of the media" got a hold of it. Good thing there are people like you who can pierce through the bullshit with the Eye of Truth.