5 ms·

I always considered myself a night owl. I'd stay up until 2-3am for the night time serenity. My partner and others disapproved and considered it unhealthy. Now

I always considered myself a night owl. I'd stay up until 2-3am for the night time serenity. My partner and others disapproved and considered it unhealthy. Now I wake around 3-4 am and get the same night time serenity. But the perception of this patten is different. I'm considered an early riser - disciplined and driven. I've noticed my concentration is much better under the new early rising regime. Here's my schedule: - 4 am. Wake up. Depending on my mood and deadlines I'll either jump straight into work or take some leisure time surfing the web. - 5 am. Dog wakes up and makes it clear that we're going for a walk. So we go to the park and play. The park is empty at this early hour so its good for training. - 7am. If I havent done so already I start work to coincide with my team on the other side of the country. - 3pm. Start winding down. Have a beer. - 5pm. Parter comes home from work and we go to the park with the dog. Lots of dogs at this time and its great fun for all. - 7pm. Dinner. - 8pm. Bed. - 4am. Wake. Does my social life suffer? Well i've found that its a case of diminishing returns. I used to be the guy who partied until 3am. Now I party until 10pm. And I've discovered I'm having just as much fun. It would seem socialising is a case of diminishing returns for me. I also avoid the shattering hangover.

ngokevin 14y ago
Hm, if I just get a dog, the social weakness in the schedule is solved! Walking the dog at 5am in the park sounds really peaceful. 8pm-4am sounds a lot better. Shifting my schedule later a few hours would be a good compromise. I still get up early, but I don't sacrifice that evening.
- loopdoend 14y ago
  I tried getting a dog to solve the same issue. It did not work out so well. If you can put up with all the whining, barking, vet visits, 3 months of basically chasing around a pooping, peeing toddler, then go for it. It is not as simple as being the "pack leader". Getting a dog is likely not going to solve your problems and you should fully investigate the myriad negative consequences of getting a dog, including robbing you of your freedom. Also, if you don't live in a house where the dog has free access to a backyard I strongly recommend against it. Your are going to need to socialize it as a puppy. Going out on walks at 5 am does not sound like a good socialization opportunity. And what is the dog going to do while you're at school?
  - angstrom 14y ago
    Many people fail to appreciate it which is why there are so many ill behaved dogs and shows like Dog Whisperer. Meanwhile the owner is still socially inept and now they spend all their time with their dog. It's like saying you should have kids so you can socialize with other parents...it doesn't add up.
    - polyfractal 14y ago
      Agreed, although it should be stated that Ceasar Milan ("Dog Whisperer") is basically a fraud that has no dog training experience and just makes shit up. There are tons of documented examples where he makes things up on the fly, entirely contradicting what he's said in previous shows. Sure, you can control any dog by beating them (literally) into submission...but you won't have a dog that enjoys your presence. His tactics are effectively "Be the boss, choke that dog, ALPHA ROLL....see how well it's behaving now? Shaking and with it's tail between it's legs?" If you get a dog, invest some time in learning about positive reinforcement training and buy yourself a $1 clicker. Your dog will love it, love you and retain it's natural curiosity...instead of crushing all sense of self-importance and initiative.
- endgame 14y ago
  I was working on a ship over new year's and was standing dock watch in the early hours of the morning (~2am). A couple of people on bikes stopped by, had a chat about the ship and rode on. Turns out they liked to do their training rides in the morning when there were no cars to get in their way. Besides, it was too hot during the day. My point is: you don't necessarily need the dog.
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  A dog is the perfect alarm clock :) It does curtail your lifestyle somewhat but so does having a family. We jokingly refer to him as our 'practice run' for having a child.
  - ycombobreaker 14y ago
    A family definitely curtails lifestyle more than a dog. I find that in an urban environment, the dog is actually much more constraining when dealing with _society_ (i.e. neglecting that a child requires much more "training" investment). Dogs can't ride public transportation. Dogs aren't welcome in cabs or many stores (esp. food stores). Poor dog behavior at home may mean constant barking, which neighbors will not tolerate. Dog parks are few and far between. etc. I could survive in the city with a kid and no car. With a dog, I need a car to take him anywhere outside of walking distance.
    - AlexDanger 14y ago
      + 1 this is an important point. We live 200 metres from a very large off leash dog park. Lots of dogs means good socialisation. Lots of off leash exercise means a contented dog who doesnt bark or cause trouble. If the park wasnt so close we either wouldnt be living here or wouldnt have a dog. Its essential in an urban area.
wybo 14y ago
There are two main issues with this sleep schedule: 1) Getting home at 5 (not likely with a job in the US, especially with a startup-job like the one I had in the valley, where performance often seems to be measured mainly by the amount of time one is physically present in the office each day) 2) Most of social life happens in the evening, even over the weekend. I guess one could get away with it in the Netherlands, or other countries where bars stay open all night, and many only start going out around midnight (one could become known as the ultimate party animal by being fully awake while others are getting sleepy around 4 AM... ;-) Finally, I did try a similar sleeping schedule for a week when I was hiking on Frazer island in Australia. To conserve the batteries of my flashlight I went to bed at sundown (around 7pm) and up with sunrise (around 4am), and I rarely felt more well-rested... But yes, due to synchronisation issues with others circadian rythms I don't think radical sleeping schedules will become common soon...
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  A couple of years ago my wife and I made a concious decision to move closer to the city. We pay more in rent but save a bundle of time/money by not driving so much. And yeah, I used to have a job where performance was measured by time spent in an office. I got a different job.
huhtenberg 14y ago
3 hours of overlap with the SO is really not much, but I guess it depends on the people involved and the circumstances.
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  Very true. We try and make that 3 hours high quality. Walking the dog at the park is a very social affair, there are a number of regular dog owners who we've become friends with. Its an off-leash park so watching them all play is very enjoyable. Dinner is very much an event in our house. I am a (very) amateur chef and cook dinner for my wife every night. Because I finish work in the afternoon I have some time to prepare something nice. After the dog walk we can have a glass of wine and then sit down for a proper dinner. Its not perfect, but much like the socialising we've found quality over quantity works for us. I'm sure this schedule will completely fall apart when we have children.
barking 14y ago
How long have you been doing this? During half the year the park must be in darkness at the hours you mention
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  Been doing it for about 18 months. For a few months the morning walk is in darkness. But the park is well lit and given our proximity to the inner city its never really pitch black outside. It does get very cold though.
gmrple 14y ago
I have attempted the pretty much the same thing. I would sleep at 9, get up at 5. I would probably like earlier, if not for my fiance's schedule and my 1+ hour commute. If your work/family/social schedules will allow it, I would highly recommend it. My jaunt into being an early riser ended when my work had a series of meetings with China all starting after 9pm. I might attempt it again after I move closer to work. I really loved working out before work.
_delirium 14y ago
I've tried this, but find waking up in the darkness hard to get used to. I mean, I can set an alarm and get up, drink some coffee, and pretend I'm now up, but it still feels like weird zombie-time until the sun starts rising to mark it "really" being morning. Whereas when I stay up late the nighttime doesn't feel like that. Could just be familiarity, but seems like the sleep->wake transition happening during darkness could be an issue. Maybe it could be artificially assisted if my apartment interior had more/brighter lights.
- Shivetya 14y ago
  I am on the flip side, I can hold a similar schedule until summer approaches as I find it near impossible to sleep while it lights out. Gone the route of lined curtains that do a great job of blocking the light. Could never get used to any sort of mask/etc. I would prefer to drive home in sunlight than drive in, but that may be because I love convertible cars
- niggler 14y ago
  It's much easier than you think. The hardest part isn't the lack of light but getting past the instinct to go back to sleep. This is a habit you can break regardless of your sleep time: when you first notice you are awake, just roll off the bed and do 20 pushups.
  - AlexDanger 14y ago
    I wouldnt have the disipline to do that. Luckily my dog has the disipline to stick his wet nose in my face every morning I accidentally sleep in.
  - lasome 14y ago
    I used to have an hour-long train commute to work each day, and I'd sleep as late as possible while still leaving myself enough time to catch my train. So at 5:40am my alarm would go off, and I HAD to get up. There was no snooze. The commute is long gone but the habit of rolling out of bed immediately never broke. I'm grateful for it. I used to spend half an hour snoozing, groggily working my way out of the bed to start my day. I didn't get a whole lot of extra rest, just wasted half an hour not really sleeping, but not doing anything else either.
niggler 14y ago
This whole scheme makes sense if your work is flex-time or if you are in california interfacing with people in new york (guessing based on "- 7am. If I havent done so already I start work to coincide with my team on the other side of the country.") When you are in new york and working on a set schedule (like the US equities markets running from 9 AM to 4 PM) its difficult to maintain a nonstandard schedule.
lupatus 14y ago
This is essentially my grandfather's sleep schedule. He uses the early morning hours to go hiking, snow shoeing, hunting, reading, and journaling. This schedule works especially well during hunting season because it allows him to have breakfast and hike out to his spot before the animals wake up with the sun. I'm considering adopting it because I telecommute and it would give me some quiet hours to work before the kids and wife wake up.
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  I also telecommute and the quiet hours are particularly valuable. A nice side effect is the reward of getting stuff done first thing in the morning. It puts me in a good frame of mind for the rest the day. Conversely, if I dont get stuff done in that morning period I feel I've wasted the opportunity to do 'real work' before the email and meeting requests start piling up.
pdelbarba 14y ago
My second life is that of a competitive collegiate rower waking at 4:30am so this all resonates very strongly with me. It's especially noticeable on campus where people will party hard and then sleep until 1pm when possible; you really come to appreciate the tranquility in the morning. Add in the rush of water moving by leaving ripples on the mirrored plane of the river and the sunrise over the city and you get a form of meditation most will never come to experience. I can't say the same as you in terms of my questionably existent social life, however.
elorant 14y ago
There's a solution to socializing under such a schedule and that is to take a nap during midday. This way you can stay up to 11pm and you have the benefit of feeling refreshed during the afternoon.

ngokevin 14y ago

Hm, if I just get a dog, the social weakness in the schedule is solved! Walking the dog at 5am in the park sounds really peaceful. 8pm-4am sounds a lot better. Shifting my schedule later a few hours would be a good compromise. I still get up early, but I don't sacrifice that evening.

loopdoend 14y ago
I tried getting a dog to solve the same issue. It did not work out so well. If you can put up with all the whining, barking, vet visits, 3 months of basically chasing around a pooping, peeing toddler, then go for it. It is not as simple as being the "pack leader". Getting a dog is likely not going to solve your problems and you should fully investigate the myriad negative consequences of getting a dog, including robbing you of your freedom. Also, if you don't live in a house where the dog has free access to a backyard I strongly recommend against it. Your are going to need to socialize it as a puppy. Going out on walks at 5 am does not sound like a good socialization opportunity. And what is the dog going to do while you're at school?
- angstrom 14y ago
  Many people fail to appreciate it which is why there are so many ill behaved dogs and shows like Dog Whisperer. Meanwhile the owner is still socially inept and now they spend all their time with their dog. It's like saying you should have kids so you can socialize with other parents...it doesn't add up.
  - polyfractal 14y ago
    Agreed, although it should be stated that Ceasar Milan ("Dog Whisperer") is basically a fraud that has no dog training experience and just makes shit up. There are tons of documented examples where he makes things up on the fly, entirely contradicting what he's said in previous shows. Sure, you can control any dog by beating them (literally) into submission...but you won't have a dog that enjoys your presence. His tactics are effectively "Be the boss, choke that dog, ALPHA ROLL....see how well it's behaving now? Shaking and with it's tail between it's legs?" If you get a dog, invest some time in learning about positive reinforcement training and buy yourself a $1 clicker. Your dog will love it, love you and retain it's natural curiosity...instead of crushing all sense of self-importance and initiative.
endgame 14y ago
I was working on a ship over new year's and was standing dock watch in the early hours of the morning (~2am). A couple of people on bikes stopped by, had a chat about the ship and rode on. Turns out they liked to do their training rides in the morning when there were no cars to get in their way. Besides, it was too hot during the day. My point is: you don't necessarily need the dog.
AlexDanger 14y ago
A dog is the perfect alarm clock :) It does curtail your lifestyle somewhat but so does having a family. We jokingly refer to him as our 'practice run' for having a child.
- ycombobreaker 14y ago
  A family definitely curtails lifestyle more than a dog. I find that in an urban environment, the dog is actually much more constraining when dealing with _society_ (i.e. neglecting that a child requires much more "training" investment). Dogs can't ride public transportation. Dogs aren't welcome in cabs or many stores (esp. food stores). Poor dog behavior at home may mean constant barking, which neighbors will not tolerate. Dog parks are few and far between. etc. I could survive in the city with a kid and no car. With a dog, I need a car to take him anywhere outside of walking distance.
  - AlexDanger 14y ago
    + 1 this is an important point. We live 200 metres from a very large off leash dog park. Lots of dogs means good socialisation. Lots of off leash exercise means a contented dog who doesnt bark or cause trouble. If the park wasnt so close we either wouldnt be living here or wouldnt have a dog. Its essential in an urban area.

wybo 14y ago

There are two main issues with this sleep schedule: 1) Getting home at 5 (not likely with a job in the US, especially with a startup-job like the one I had in the valley, where performance often seems to be measured mainly by the amount of time one is physically present in the office each day) 2) Most of social life happens in the evening, even over the weekend. I guess one could get away with it in the Netherlands, or other countries where bars stay open all night, and many only start going out around midnight (one could become known as the ultimate party animal by being fully awake while others are getting sleepy around 4 AM... ;-) Finally, I did try a similar sleeping schedule for a week when I was hiking on Frazer island in Australia. To conserve the batteries of my flashlight I went to bed at sundown (around 7pm) and up with sunrise (around 4am), and I rarely felt more well-rested... But yes, due to synchronisation issues with others circadian rythms I don't think radical sleeping schedules will become common soon...

AlexDanger 14y ago
A couple of years ago my wife and I made a concious decision to move closer to the city. We pay more in rent but save a bundle of time/money by not driving so much. And yeah, I used to have a job where performance was measured by time spent in an office. I got a different job.

huhtenberg 14y ago

3 hours of overlap with the SO is really not much, but I guess it depends on the people involved and the circumstances.

AlexDanger 14y ago
Very true. We try and make that 3 hours high quality. Walking the dog at the park is a very social affair, there are a number of regular dog owners who we've become friends with. Its an off-leash park so watching them all play is very enjoyable. Dinner is very much an event in our house. I am a (very) amateur chef and cook dinner for my wife every night. Because I finish work in the afternoon I have some time to prepare something nice. After the dog walk we can have a glass of wine and then sit down for a proper dinner. Its not perfect, but much like the socialising we've found quality over quantity works for us. I'm sure this schedule will completely fall apart when we have children.

barking 14y ago

How long have you been doing this? During half the year the park must be in darkness at the hours you mention

AlexDanger 14y ago
Been doing it for about 18 months. For a few months the morning walk is in darkness. But the park is well lit and given our proximity to the inner city its never really pitch black outside. It does get very cold though.

gmrple 14y ago

I have attempted the pretty much the same thing. I would sleep at 9, get up at 5. I would probably like earlier, if not for my fiance's schedule and my 1+ hour commute. If your work/family/social schedules will allow it, I would highly recommend it. My jaunt into being an early riser ended when my work had a series of meetings with China all starting after 9pm. I might attempt it again after I move closer to work. I really loved working out before work.

_delirium 14y ago

I've tried this, but find waking up in the darkness hard to get used to. I mean, I can set an alarm and get up, drink some coffee, and pretend I'm now up, but it still feels like weird zombie-time until the sun starts rising to mark it "really" being morning. Whereas when I stay up late the nighttime doesn't feel like that. Could just be familiarity, but seems like the sleep->wake transition happening during darkness could be an issue. Maybe it could be artificially assisted if my apartment interior had more/brighter lights.

Shivetya 14y ago
I am on the flip side, I can hold a similar schedule until summer approaches as I find it near impossible to sleep while it lights out. Gone the route of lined curtains that do a great job of blocking the light. Could never get used to any sort of mask/etc. I would prefer to drive home in sunlight than drive in, but that may be because I love convertible cars
niggler 14y ago
It's much easier than you think. The hardest part isn't the lack of light but getting past the instinct to go back to sleep. This is a habit you can break regardless of your sleep time: when you first notice you are awake, just roll off the bed and do 20 pushups.
- AlexDanger 14y ago
  I wouldnt have the disipline to do that. Luckily my dog has the disipline to stick his wet nose in my face every morning I accidentally sleep in.
- lasome 14y ago
  I used to have an hour-long train commute to work each day, and I'd sleep as late as possible while still leaving myself enough time to catch my train. So at 5:40am my alarm would go off, and I HAD to get up. There was no snooze. The commute is long gone but the habit of rolling out of bed immediately never broke. I'm grateful for it. I used to spend half an hour snoozing, groggily working my way out of the bed to start my day. I didn't get a whole lot of extra rest, just wasted half an hour not really sleeping, but not doing anything else either.

niggler 14y ago

This whole scheme makes sense if your work is flex-time or if you are in california interfacing with people in new york (guessing based on "- 7am. If I havent done so already I start work to coincide with my team on the other side of the country.") When you are in new york and working on a set schedule (like the US equities markets running from 9 AM to 4 PM) its difficult to maintain a nonstandard schedule.

lupatus 14y ago

This is essentially my grandfather's sleep schedule. He uses the early morning hours to go hiking, snow shoeing, hunting, reading, and journaling. This schedule works especially well during hunting season because it allows him to have breakfast and hike out to his spot before the animals wake up with the sun. I'm considering adopting it because I telecommute and it would give me some quiet hours to work before the kids and wife wake up.

AlexDanger 14y ago
I also telecommute and the quiet hours are particularly valuable. A nice side effect is the reward of getting stuff done first thing in the morning. It puts me in a good frame of mind for the rest the day. Conversely, if I dont get stuff done in that morning period I feel I've wasted the opportunity to do 'real work' before the email and meeting requests start piling up.

pdelbarba 14y ago

My second life is that of a competitive collegiate rower waking at 4:30am so this all resonates very strongly with me. It's especially noticeable on campus where people will party hard and then sleep until 1pm when possible; you really come to appreciate the tranquility in the morning. Add in the rush of water moving by leaving ripples on the mirrored plane of the river and the sunrise over the city and you get a form of meditation most will never come to experience. I can't say the same as you in terms of my questionably existent social life, however.

elorant 14y ago

There's a solution to socializing under such a schedule and that is to take a nap during midday. This way you can stay up to 11pm and you have the benefit of feeling refreshed during the afternoon.