Nice point about your keyboard, but I'd still contend that a series of fast keystrokes is perceived as a thrum, not necessarily a series of clicks. If you're p

Nice point about your keyboard, but I'd still contend that a series of fast keystrokes is perceived as a thrum, not necessarily a series of clicks. If you're programming DSP, then the haptic upper limits of typing is much slower than the limits of aural perception. But I understand more about what you mean by "steady frame" now. Yes I think you're right in our point of disagreement. In Chris Nash's terms, you're interested in liveness solely in terms of manipulation-driven feedback loop, and I'm interested in it predominantly in terms of performance-driven feedback loop, and only secondarily in manipulation-driven feedback. The diagrams at the end of this paper might clarify: http://www.eecs.umich.edu/nime2012/Proceedings/papers/217_Final_Manuscript.pdf http://www.eecs.umich.edu/nime2012/Proceedings/papers/217_Fi... (I've seen a more detailed version of this somewhere, maybe his PhD thesis)