3 ms·

Considering the degree that defense spending props up the US economy, yes.

cscurmudgeon 14y ago
That does not show anything. A motive perhaps, but nothing more. On the other hand, we have stark evidence of China being nefarious right in front of us.
- greghinch 14y ago
  Eh, most of what they are doing is corporate espionage with the intent of copying and cost cutting. If your business is susceptible to being undercut on price alone, your days are numbered regardless.
  - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
    This is getting off-topic, but: I put in $E amount of effort to produce a product priced at $X (let us say a software product). Somebody steals the source code I use to produce the product and sells the same product at $X-E killing my business. How is this justified in any sense? Yes, there have been cases of Chinese hackers stealing source code.
    - greghinch 14y ago
      There is a lot more to running a successful business than dev cost A and price B. and this is why so many Chinese clones fail
      - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
        "There is a lot more to running a successful business than dev cost A and price B. and this is why so many Chinese clones fail" Aargh. That does not make it moral or legal.
wololo 14y ago
> the degree that defense spending props up the US economy US defense spending was 4.7% of GDP in 2011. What do you call the other 95.3%? (context: Russia 3.9%, China 2.0%, World 2.5%) --SIPRI
- iooi 14y ago
  It's a lot more useful to compare defense spending to the budget, not GDP. Would also be nice to see your sources. In 2011 defense spending was 20% of the budget, and in real terms the US spent more than the next 13 highest spending nations combined (China, Russia, UK, France, Japan, India, Saudi Arabia, Germany, to name a few). [0] [0] http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/07/everything-chuck-hagel-needs-to-know-about-the-defense-budget-in-charts/ http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/07/e...
  - wololo 14y ago
    http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/MS.MIL.XPND.GD.ZS?order=wbapi_data_value_2011+wbapi_data_value+wbapi_data_value-last&sort=desc http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/MS.MIL.XPND.GD.ZS?order=... (with nice description of what it includes and excludes) > It's a lot more useful to compare defense spending to the budget, not GDP Different types of government will lead to the same expenditures being handled within the government's budget and not. US budget/GDP is low, so using that ratio instead makes it look misleadingly high (since you get to 4x it). budget/GDP ratio examples: Cuba 86.5%, France 55.7%, UK 50.9%, US 23.6%, China 23.0%, India 17.5% https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2056.html https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/... > US spent more than the next 13 highest spending nations combined If you're comparing how countries allocate their resources, you divide their absolute numbers by the amount of resources they have (debt-to-GDP, etc). By example: the US produced 46,500,000 tonnes of salt in 2006, and France 7,000,000 tonnes. US salt epidemic! But that salt production ratio is 6.64, and their 2006 GDP ratio is 5.837. edit: if you like 80s-90s US/NATO/world military expenditure comparisons, this is comprehensive: http://csis.org/files/media/csis/pubs/bwcfcompsummary%5B1%5D.pdf http://csis.org/files/media/csis/pubs/bwcfcompsummary%5B1%5D...

That does not show anything. A motive perhaps, but nothing more. On the other hand, we have stark evidence of China being nefarious right in front of us.

greghinch 14y ago
Eh, most of what they are doing is corporate espionage with the intent of copying and cost cutting. If your business is susceptible to being undercut on price alone, your days are numbered regardless.
- cscurmudgeon 14y ago
  This is getting off-topic, but: I put in $E amount of effort to produce a product priced at $X (let us say a software product). Somebody steals the source code I use to produce the product and sells the same product at $X-E killing my business. How is this justified in any sense? Yes, there have been cases of Chinese hackers stealing source code.
  - greghinch 14y ago
    There is a lot more to running a successful business than dev cost A and price B. and this is why so many Chinese clones fail
    - cscurmudgeon 14y ago
      "There is a lot more to running a successful business than dev cost A and price B. and this is why so many Chinese clones fail" Aargh. That does not make it moral or legal.

wololo 14y ago

> the degree that defense spending props up the US economy US defense spending was 4.7% of GDP in 2011. What do you call the other 95.3%? (context: Russia 3.9%, China 2.0%, World 2.5%) --SIPRI

iooi 14y ago
It's a lot more useful to compare defense spending to the budget, not GDP. Would also be nice to see your sources. In 2011 defense spending was 20% of the budget, and in real terms the US spent more than the next 13 highest spending nations combined (China, Russia, UK, France, Japan, India, Saudi Arabia, Germany, to name a few). [0] [0] http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/07/everything-chuck-hagel-needs-to-know-about-the-defense-budget-in-charts/ http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/07/e...
- wololo 14y ago
  http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/MS.MIL.XPND.GD.ZS?order=wbapi_data_value_2011+wbapi_data_value+wbapi_data_value-last&sort=desc http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/MS.MIL.XPND.GD.ZS?order=... (with nice description of what it includes and excludes) > It's a lot more useful to compare defense spending to the budget, not GDP Different types of government will lead to the same expenditures being handled within the government's budget and not. US budget/GDP is low, so using that ratio instead makes it look misleadingly high (since you get to 4x it). budget/GDP ratio examples: Cuba 86.5%, France 55.7%, UK 50.9%, US 23.6%, China 23.0%, India 17.5% https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2056.html https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/... > US spent more than the next 13 highest spending nations combined If you're comparing how countries allocate their resources, you divide their absolute numbers by the amount of resources they have (debt-to-GDP, etc). By example: the US produced 46,500,000 tonnes of salt in 2006, and France 7,000,000 tonnes. US salt epidemic! But that salt production ratio is 6.64, and their 2006 GDP ratio is 5.837. edit: if you like 80s-90s US/NATO/world military expenditure comparisons, this is comprehensive: http://csis.org/files/media/csis/pubs/bwcfcompsummary%5B1%5D.pdf http://csis.org/files/media/csis/pubs/bwcfcompsummary%5B1%5D...