3 ms·

The problem isn't TSA. The problem is that we and the world have not delivered a sufficiently severe set of consequences for engaging in terrorism. If you hav

The problem isn't TSA. The problem is that we and the world have not delivered a sufficiently severe set of consequences for engaging in terrorism. If you have small children you've seen this at work a million times. It could be about not touching a hot pot or not abusing the cat. Sometimes you can repeat your "don't do <x>" a million times and it simply does not register. Kids are wired that way, and, I suspect, most of us remain wired that way for some time. When does the behavior stop? When they touch the hot pot and get burned or when they mess with the cat too much and they are attacked. Just to clarify, none of these things happened to my kids because (a) I got lucky and they tend to listen and, (b) we don't own a cat. The point is that TSA and a bunch of other measures none of us like (Patriot act anyone?) were a reaction to an absolute failure to communicate, in no uncertain terms, that terrorism has severe and dire consequences. Almost unimaginable consequences that not one person on this planet would want to provoke. We are not a "hot pot" or a "cat" in the eyes of any of these people. We are a country and a people to be messed with because the consequences just don't hurt enough. And so is much, if not all of the West and Europe. This is a problem when you have an ideology and people who are living 800 years behind the rest of the planet. No? Ha! Go ask their women, their homosexuals and anyone who dares express such vile things as wanting women to be educated. Maybe 800 years is too small of a number, maybe it's more like 1,500 years. What consequences am I talking about? No point in going into it. The opportunity was lost over a decade ago. I am not sure I am smart enough to even begin to imagine what could be done today. You have to turn the environments within which would-be terrorists are cooked-up into environments where not one person would even consider the idea of terrorism due to a clear understanding of the consequences. Do that. Accomplish that. And you can shutdown the TSA, Homeland Security, the Patriot Act and all else that is making our lives miserable and expensive. Yes. They won. Why would anyone doubt that? Look at all you've given up in the name of security. Sad.

darkarmani 14y ago
> The point is that TSA and a bunch of other measures none of us like (Patriot act anyone?) were a reaction to an absolute failure to communicate, in no uncertain terms, that terrorism has severe and dire consequences. Almost unimaginable consequences that not one person on this planet would want to provoke. So you think it is possible to have absolute security? The TSA and Patriot Act are similar to irrational escalation or commitment bias ala "throw bad money after good money." We've already suffered a massive loss of life and money, but we'll throw all of this money at the problem that has passed and take away a number of liberties. The downside of an open society is the ability to be harmed. Giving up that openness doesn't seem like much of a trade for the margin security it provides.
- robomartin 14y ago
  > So you think it is possible to have absolute security? Really. Where did I say that? Sometimes it is really interesting how people read what they want out of what someone else wrote. I actually got an email from someone pissed because he saw me advocating for nuking the entire middle east in my post. That is simply fucking amazing. I don't have any other way to say it. Why do "consequences" always have to mean such extremes. For clarification, what I meant by "severe consequences" was ideas like utter and absolute isolation from the rest of the world for fifty years or some such thing. In exchange for being allowed back into the world of the civilized these societies would have to make a real effort to come into this century. Yes, that means respect women, human rights, promote education and other things. Not a perfect solution by any measure. I am far from a political/international-relations/cultural dynamics expert. I just know when something is really, really fucked up. And the Middle East (known as Asia in other parts of the world) is really, really fucked up. The TSA, Homeland Security and the Patriot Act would not need to exist if the Middle East was locked-down solid until their leaders, clergy, etc. accepted the fact that they are being assholes to their own people and the world and let go. Enough already.

darkarmani 14y ago

> The point is that TSA and a bunch of other measures none of us like (Patriot act anyone?) were a reaction to an absolute failure to communicate, in no uncertain terms, that terrorism has severe and dire consequences. Almost unimaginable consequences that not one person on this planet would want to provoke. So you think it is possible to have absolute security? The TSA and Patriot Act are similar to irrational escalation or commitment bias ala "throw bad money after good money." We've already suffered a massive loss of life and money, but we'll throw all of this money at the problem that has passed and take away a number of liberties. The downside of an open society is the ability to be harmed. Giving up that openness doesn't seem like much of a trade for the margin security it provides.

robomartin 14y ago
> So you think it is possible to have absolute security? Really. Where did I say that? Sometimes it is really interesting how people read what they want out of what someone else wrote. I actually got an email from someone pissed because he saw me advocating for nuking the entire middle east in my post. That is simply fucking amazing. I don't have any other way to say it. Why do "consequences" always have to mean such extremes. For clarification, what I meant by "severe consequences" was ideas like utter and absolute isolation from the rest of the world for fifty years or some such thing. In exchange for being allowed back into the world of the civilized these societies would have to make a real effort to come into this century. Yes, that means respect women, human rights, promote education and other things. Not a perfect solution by any measure. I am far from a political/international-relations/cultural dynamics expert. I just know when something is really, really fucked up. And the Middle East (known as Asia in other parts of the world) is really, really fucked up. The TSA, Homeland Security and the Patriot Act would not need to exist if the Middle East was locked-down solid until their leaders, clergy, etc. accepted the fact that they are being assholes to their own people and the world and let go. Enough already.