5 ms·

Ask HN: Career advice for a 23 year-old

8 points by dbert 14y ago

Hi HN, I'm 23 years old, living in Belgium, and about to graduate with a master's degree in electrical engineering. It's a difficult time with lots of choices to make, and I'm not sure which path to take next. Some considerations: - I feel like I'm too young to leave the student life and its freedoms completely behind. - I'm ambitious and have good grades, but don't want to pursue a PhD. - A year of travelling would be great, but my mother would get a heart attack when I tell her. And I guess it will make me look lazy on my resume. - My ultimate day-dream is to launch a start-up and work and live on-campus for the next five years. Alas, it's not Stanford here. - More realistically, a job in consulting would maybe be a good idea as a start. It would keep my options open. But should I look into management consulting or technology consulting? I think the latter will be a better fit with my studies and personality, but it's not as prestigious or ambitious as the first. Any advice here? Oh, the choices! Thanks for your advice. Bert

filvdg 14y ago
Bert, I am doing consulting in Belgium, in general as a consultant you are selling a service , that service is yourself , you need to define what are the unique skills, experience you have that makes you special , the more special you are, the higher your day rate will be. so the key is to develop your skills. if you want to do startups i would advise you this belgian startup coaching program http://www.iminds.be/en/entrepreneurship/training-coaching/boot-camp http://www.iminds.be/en/entrepreneurship/training-coaching/b... Fil
- dbert 14y ago
  Thanks Fil. What kind of consulting do you do? Do/did you work for one of the big three? I hadn't heard of the iMinds program yet, it looks interesting.
  - filvdg 14y ago
    I never worked for the big three , i once did an interview, with my long hair back in the days and refusing to wear a suit, it did not feel like a match ... There are agencies that specialize in brokering freelance consultants , but it all depends on your CV , so the best thing to do is to fill it with some nice projects like the http://www.hixup.com/ http://www.hixup.com/ you made ... , if you want to discuss in detail , mail me at HN id@gmail.com
tkone 14y ago
Sick it up and join the real world. I've been working since I was 14 years old due to the economic realities of my family. Don't want a real office job? Go volunteer or join something like the peace corps. You'll get to travel, feel good about yourself, and help the world.
lifeisstillgood 14y ago
Can I recommend Brennan Dunn's monthly classes on Freelancing and consulting - mostly because there is a brilliant and active mailing list , with at least one Belgium on the list who has taken the path you are considering. Drop me your email and I will put you in touch More generally, take the rest of your twenties to explore and push. You have (I assume) no child care responsibilities and its a good guess you wont till thirty-ish (if it changes - great !) - so can I recommend the following plan: 0. Unemployment is rife across Europe, especially at your age - so if in two years you have not had a "proper" job, it will look no different than 50% of the rest of the continent. But if you have run a startup, consulted, travelled... well... 1. With a degree in electrical engineering you have a massive advantage over most startup entrpreneurs - hardware. 2. Go look at the hardware hackday running with ycombinator (cannot find the link - on iPhone - anyone?). It might give you some ideas. 3. Market yourself as a prototype maker - join some maker groups, get some experience with arduino's etc. Maybe the local fashion college has people wanting to experiment with wearable fashion (plus point here - fashion students throw much better parties than EE departments) 4. Start talking about this - in English on a blog. Include youtube videos of the wearable stuff. 5. Want to travel - then stick to the hardware theme. DO the young backpacker thing, but ask on HN for contacts in Shenzhen and Mumbai. Go meet some folks and make contacts / friends. Be the Belgium hardware consultant with contacts in the hottest hardware and development hubs globally. Blog on your travels, and if you can, do some arduino prototyping and consulting - getting paid to develop a startups new wearable toy whilst actually in Shenzhen. Better than paying yourself. And stop off in Goa and dive in Thailand - just because you need to relax. In the end you are young - enjoy yourself. But be smart - enjoy yourself and at the same time build valueable skills. You already have a massive edge - increase that edge. Remember you are a rare commoditity and investment money is dirt cheap globally - so if you need to raise cash later on you are the prize for them to compete for.
- dbert 14y ago
  Thanks for your motivating words! The travel idea sounds so exciting but it would be a big step out of my comfort zone. Is http://freelancersweekly.com/ http://freelancersweekly.com/ the newsletter you were talking about? My email is hndbert at gmail.
shail 14y ago
Wanna come to India. I am looking for a co-founder. The living expenses will be cheaper here for you and lots of learning for sure. I am 31 and have some experience building web apps. Contact me: shail2@live.com if interested.
guruz 14y ago
Do the travel thing, possible while doing some small projects for yourself or others. The real world can wait. (and you have to step up against your parents at some point anyway) (I'm 28 and wish I would have done it, although I am very happy with my current life (=flexible consulting startup) too)
xijuan 14y ago
If you want to come to Vancouver, I can meet you up and bring you around. You can find my contact info in my profile.
phulst 14y ago
Hi Bert, I felt like I had to respond to this, because our backgrounds are so similar and I was facing the same questions years ago. here's my advice: Travel while you can. You'll learn more valuable life lessons in a year of travelling than you will in 10 years of, well, doing almost anything else. I am Dutch, studied Electrical Engineering too, and left Holland when I was 24. I left for a 1 year working holiday in Australia, but I ended up spending 8 months in New Zealand as well, so was away for 20 months. It turned out it's pretty easy to get a temporary work permit in NZ as well if you have some technical skills, and I was able to fund a much longer trip by doing some consulting for the bank of New Zealand. After 6 months back in Holland, I left again, this time on a one way ticket to Indonesia. After exploring South East Asia for another 10 months, I ended flying to San Francisco to visit the US for the first time, in hopes of being able to find a job in Silicon Valley, make some money there and then move on with my travels. I never moved on. Almost 14 years later, I'm still in the SF bay area, and I am now founder and CEO of my own bootstrapped startup, and an independent software consultant. I'm married, have 2 kids, live in a great place, and have always felt that that decision to go traveling was the best decision I've made in my life. Without those travels, I don't know where I'd be right now, but highly unlikely that it would be here. I think the things you learn by traveling to an unknown place, with unspecified plans, prepare you better for entrepreneurship than pretty much anything you would learn in an office. On the road, you'll learn to be comfortable with the unknown, you'll be forced to look for creative solutions, to pivot when necessary. You'll widen your horizon and expose yourself to new places, other cultures, new ideas. You'll learn valuable social skills, you'll learn to get along with people that you have almost nothing in common with. You'll experience all the benefits of having to venture outside of the fairly small demographic that you are in at home. You'll learn to appreciate and make the best of what you have, however little that may be. Maybe I was just lucky, being able to find jobs on the way, and making it to San Francisco at the height of the dot-com boom, when developers were treated like gods and immigrant work visas were easier to come by. But you may be surprised by the random opportunities you will end up walking into if you just go out on a whim, like I did at the time. Some people may have thought of me as a lazy bum as I was roaming around the world, but I always knew that it was the right thing to do for me, and that it would make me a better person, a better dad and a more successful entrepreneur down the line. If you need any more convincing: I've never talked to anyone who regretted going traveling. I've spoken to hundreds of people who regret not having done it before they were tied down by careers, families, mortgages and other adult responsibilities. My advice for you, save up some money, do some consulting and get a little bit of working experience, and then venture out into the unknown. Try to find some work abroad, even if it's unskilled work. (I also picked kiwis in New Zealand and worked in a small factory in Sydney). And then, while you are away, you'll have plenty of time to think about what you want to do with the rest of your life. Or somehow you'll find that those questions will be answered for you.
pasbesoin 14y ago
Always place your health foremost. A chronic/permanent injury or illness changes things dramatically and irrevocably. Good health is the foundation of functioning well, in whatever you choose to do.

8 points by dbert 14y ago

filvdg 14y ago

Bert, I am doing consulting in Belgium, in general as a consultant you are selling a service , that service is yourself , you need to define what are the unique skills, experience you have that makes you special , the more special you are, the higher your day rate will be. so the key is to develop your skills. if you want to do startups i would advise you this belgian startup coaching program http://www.iminds.be/en/entrepreneurship/training-coaching/boot-camp http://www.iminds.be/en/entrepreneurship/training-coaching/b... Fil

dbert 14y ago
Thanks Fil. What kind of consulting do you do? Do/did you work for one of the big three? I hadn't heard of the iMinds program yet, it looks interesting.
- filvdg 14y ago
  I never worked for the big three , i once did an interview, with my long hair back in the days and refusing to wear a suit, it did not feel like a match ... There are agencies that specialize in brokering freelance consultants , but it all depends on your CV , so the best thing to do is to fill it with some nice projects like the http://www.hixup.com/ http://www.hixup.com/ you made ... , if you want to discuss in detail , mail me at HN id@gmail.com

tkone 14y ago

Sick it up and join the real world. I've been working since I was 14 years old due to the economic realities of my family. Don't want a real office job? Go volunteer or join something like the peace corps. You'll get to travel, feel good about yourself, and help the world.

lifeisstillgood 14y ago

Can I recommend Brennan Dunn's monthly classes on Freelancing and consulting - mostly because there is a brilliant and active mailing list , with at least one Belgium on the list who has taken the path you are considering. Drop me your email and I will put you in touch More generally, take the rest of your twenties to explore and push. You have (I assume) no child care responsibilities and its a good guess you wont till thirty-ish (if it changes - great !) - so can I recommend the following plan: 0. Unemployment is rife across Europe, especially at your age - so if in two years you have not had a "proper" job, it will look no different than 50% of the rest of the continent. But if you have run a startup, consulted, travelled... well... 1. With a degree in electrical engineering you have a massive advantage over most startup entrpreneurs - hardware. 2. Go look at the hardware hackday running with ycombinator (cannot find the link - on iPhone - anyone?). It might give you some ideas. 3. Market yourself as a prototype maker - join some maker groups, get some experience with arduino's etc. Maybe the local fashion college has people wanting to experiment with wearable fashion (plus point here - fashion students throw much better parties than EE departments) 4. Start talking about this - in English on a blog. Include youtube videos of the wearable stuff. 5. Want to travel - then stick to the hardware theme. DO the young backpacker thing, but ask on HN for contacts in Shenzhen and Mumbai. Go meet some folks and make contacts / friends. Be the Belgium hardware consultant with contacts in the hottest hardware and development hubs globally. Blog on your travels, and if you can, do some arduino prototyping and consulting - getting paid to develop a startups new wearable toy whilst actually in Shenzhen. Better than paying yourself. And stop off in Goa and dive in Thailand - just because you need to relax. In the end you are young - enjoy yourself. But be smart - enjoy yourself and at the same time build valueable skills. You already have a massive edge - increase that edge. Remember you are a rare commoditity and investment money is dirt cheap globally - so if you need to raise cash later on you are the prize for them to compete for.

dbert 14y ago
Thanks for your motivating words! The travel idea sounds so exciting but it would be a big step out of my comfort zone. Is http://freelancersweekly.com/ http://freelancersweekly.com/ the newsletter you were talking about? My email is hndbert at gmail.

shail 14y ago

Wanna come to India. I am looking for a co-founder. The living expenses will be cheaper here for you and lots of learning for sure. I am 31 and have some experience building web apps. Contact me: shail2@live.com if interested.

guruz 14y ago

Do the travel thing, possible while doing some small projects for yourself or others. The real world can wait. (and you have to step up against your parents at some point anyway) (I'm 28 and wish I would have done it, although I am very happy with my current life (=flexible consulting startup) too)

xijuan 14y ago

If you want to come to Vancouver, I can meet you up and bring you around. You can find my contact info in my profile.

phulst 14y ago

Hi Bert, I felt like I had to respond to this, because our backgrounds are so similar and I was facing the same questions years ago. here's my advice: Travel while you can. You'll learn more valuable life lessons in a year of travelling than you will in 10 years of, well, doing almost anything else. I am Dutch, studied Electrical Engineering too, and left Holland when I was 24. I left for a 1 year working holiday in Australia, but I ended up spending 8 months in New Zealand as well, so was away for 20 months. It turned out it's pretty easy to get a temporary work permit in NZ as well if you have some technical skills, and I was able to fund a much longer trip by doing some consulting for the bank of New Zealand. After 6 months back in Holland, I left again, this time on a one way ticket to Indonesia. After exploring South East Asia for another 10 months, I ended flying to San Francisco to visit the US for the first time, in hopes of being able to find a job in Silicon Valley, make some money there and then move on with my travels. I never moved on. Almost 14 years later, I'm still in the SF bay area, and I am now founder and CEO of my own bootstrapped startup, and an independent software consultant. I'm married, have 2 kids, live in a great place, and have always felt that that decision to go traveling was the best decision I've made in my life. Without those travels, I don't know where I'd be right now, but highly unlikely that it would be here. I think the things you learn by traveling to an unknown place, with unspecified plans, prepare you better for entrepreneurship than pretty much anything you would learn in an office. On the road, you'll learn to be comfortable with the unknown, you'll be forced to look for creative solutions, to pivot when necessary. You'll widen your horizon and expose yourself to new places, other cultures, new ideas. You'll learn valuable social skills, you'll learn to get along with people that you have almost nothing in common with. You'll experience all the benefits of having to venture outside of the fairly small demographic that you are in at home. You'll learn to appreciate and make the best of what you have, however little that may be. Maybe I was just lucky, being able to find jobs on the way, and making it to San Francisco at the height of the dot-com boom, when developers were treated like gods and immigrant work visas were easier to come by. But you may be surprised by the random opportunities you will end up walking into if you just go out on a whim, like I did at the time. Some people may have thought of me as a lazy bum as I was roaming around the world, but I always knew that it was the right thing to do for me, and that it would make me a better person, a better dad and a more successful entrepreneur down the line. If you need any more convincing: I've never talked to anyone who regretted going traveling. I've spoken to hundreds of people who regret not having done it before they were tied down by careers, families, mortgages and other adult responsibilities. My advice for you, save up some money, do some consulting and get a little bit of working experience, and then venture out into the unknown. Try to find some work abroad, even if it's unskilled work. (I also picked kiwis in New Zealand and worked in a small factory in Sydney). And then, while you are away, you'll have plenty of time to think about what you want to do with the rest of your life. Or somehow you'll find that those questions will be answered for you.

pasbesoin 14y ago

Always place your health foremost. A chronic/permanent injury or illness changes things dramatically and irrevocably. Good health is the foundation of functioning well, in whatever you choose to do.