6 ms·

"I deliberately emotionally detach from such thoughts to allow me to do my job fairly" How do you do that? (neutral question)

ErrantX 18y ago
Great question thanks In terms of viewing images it is quite hard. Partly I manage it due to my personality (empathy troubles etc. which is ideal for disconnecting). Mostly though it is by multi threading: I program & pen test for the company I work at so I occupy my mind with programming/hacking problems for later whilst leaving part of me on neutral to process cases. And then just through sheer will power :) At first it was difficult to do but I find it easier and easier to function perfectly normally (i.e. thoroughly and effectively do an investigation) whilst not fully connecting with the content :) (Also we use hash analysis to cut down the amount of actual content we view - standard practice). If you mean in terms of not feeling angry at suspects etc. - that is difficult but I find ways to channel my dislike outside of work (kickboxing, occasionally alcohol, arguing with my GF):) and carefully control it when in the office. Again - practice makes that easier. Not for everyone but I (and I hesitate to use this word because of the context) enjoy it.
- Retric 18y ago
  I salute you. Most people who deal with the darker side of humanity see / learn things they wish they could unsee. But, I suspect your job is far more difficult than most.
  - sho 18y ago
    Well I don't salute him at all. Think about what he's doing. He is examining computers for illegal information. An illegal series of bytes. This is utterly insane. You can make up whatever justification you want, but to me the very existence, the very possibility of existence, of illegal information is absolutely, 180˚ opposed to everything I believe in. As far as I am concerned, people like ErrantX are actively working to undermine free society. The fact that many of these illegal files are simply scans of magazines you could apparently buy, completely legally, over the counter, in the 1970s, just adds that last twist of "We have always been at war with Eurasia" doublethink frisson.
    - jpd 18y ago
      Photography is strange; it exists solely to please the eye. One can say that the act of looking at it, is similar to how one would USE other sorts of information, and although that's not quite right either it serves well-enough (in reality intentions matter when talking about this issue, otherwise the cops that verify someone has CP are criminals themselves.) So, that said, it's not the HAVING the information that matters, it's the using of it. If I have your bank account information on my computer it's not illegal for me to have it (I think), but it would certainly give me jail time if I used it to take money out of your account.
    - aditya 18y ago
      Right. And your free society would actually celebrate people that produce and distribute things like child pornography, hell, you'd actually sell your own children into the business, right? I'm sorry but anarchy and freedom from coercion such as taxes are good things that we'd be interested in talking about as hackers, but you're coming out in support of child porn to support your claim of freedom. There is no doublethink here, child porn is wrong, that is objective reality.
      - sho 18y ago
        Wow, you really demolished that straw man you set up there. I'm not advocating child porn, nor anarchy, nor any other of your bizarre projections. Get a grip. "child porn is wrong, that is objective reality." Your proclamations of what is right or wrong have no place in "objective reality", my friend. Objective reality simply is. "you're coming out in support of child porn to support your claim of freedom" Well I didn't really mean to "come out in support of" it but why not, sure, for the sake of argument. And I presume you're "coming out" in favour of a world in which you can be thrown in jail at any time for the existence, on a computer under your control, of a copy of a photo you didn't take?
        aditya 18y ago
        grin. sorry for sounding annoyed, that wasn't the idea (so much for being objective :) Since you didn't mean to come out in support of child porn (which is what it sounded like you were doing, by proclaiming the government shouldn't be able to go after our bits) - I think it's been determined in this thread that having mistakenly had a copy of a photo on your computer doesn't make you a user, or prosecutable by law. My point was that being associated with Child Pornography (user, distributor, creator) knowing that you're doing it willfully is wrong and should be prosecutable. Now I'm not sure whether we disagree.
  - ErrantX 18y ago
    Thank you for saying so :) I dislike getting "sympathy" or "understanding" for my job (not that you've done that). I chose it :D I do my bit and that is it's own reward. I've quite enjoyed chatting about it on here though (I do feel a bit of a cheat that it's earned me nearly 100 Karma in total). You guys have asked much more interesting questions than anyone else does :D
    - jimmyjim 18y ago
      Okay, then I guess you won't mind answering a few questions I have. Down to it, what is so fundamentally wrong with CP? There is no universal consensus of what is beautiful, what is ugly -- the human libido desires whatever it desires; black, white, brown, tall, fat, short, thin, male, female, etc. etc. Why is it a problem that one person prefers the flesh that of the youth? Centuries ago, the traditional relationship actually WAS between one person of considerably older age with one of a significantly younger age. I anticipate the following responses: 1) Because it indirectly creates a demand for CP in general and it is thereby criminal. 2.1) Because it is immoral (religiously, culturally, etc.) 2.2) Because children aren't mature enough to decide for themselves, they should not be involved in CP and adults should not pursue relationships with them. My responses: 1) Which is precisely why it should be made legal. I think it would expunge the market of concretely illegal media. This, in my thinking, is appropriately analogous to the drug situation. If drug X is legalized, the availability of a safer form of drug X would likely appear in market and the impure, dangerous forms of it would naturally cease to circulate (in ideal conditions). OBVIOUSLY I don't condone any physical violence toward anyone. One thing that I CANNOT wrap my head around is BSDM-related porn. And by God, if anyone harms their child, or any other's for that matter, get them some counseling. Pronto. 2) It is decided merely as such by the culture. I take it that the general populace on HN is of atheists -- why then, as atheists, would you shun the the preference of a certain type of body as unnatural, immoral, or illegal? Your thoughts? //Disclaimer: I'm not involved in/with CP in any manner whatsoever, I only believe that it should be "legal" in the same manner free speech is. I believe NOTHING should be censored by ANY governing body, rather, it should be with products and services offered by private entities that CP and other related things should be "blocked for viewing" solely at the behest of the end-user. And yes, then I would encourage any such user to turn that "feature" on to block questionable material. But in the general scheme of things: ZERO CENSORSHIP. //P.S.: Please pardon spelling/grammatical errors, I don't have time to check what I've written. EDIT: HN, please stop downmodding/marking/whatever-you-call-it-here me, it would be against the HN-etiquette as I understand it (downvote for troll behavior, but not for differing opinions). Furthermore, I invite any discussion that goes against what I have said to what I have said. Cheers!

ErrantX 18y ago

Great question thanks In terms of viewing images it is quite hard. Partly I manage it due to my personality (empathy troubles etc. which is ideal for disconnecting). Mostly though it is by multi threading: I program & pen test for the company I work at so I occupy my mind with programming/hacking problems for later whilst leaving part of me on neutral to process cases. And then just through sheer will power :) At first it was difficult to do but I find it easier and easier to function perfectly normally (i.e. thoroughly and effectively do an investigation) whilst not fully connecting with the content :) (Also we use hash analysis to cut down the amount of actual content we view - standard practice). If you mean in terms of not feeling angry at suspects etc. - that is difficult but I find ways to channel my dislike outside of work (kickboxing, occasionally alcohol, arguing with my GF):) and carefully control it when in the office. Again - practice makes that easier. Not for everyone but I (and I hesitate to use this word because of the context) enjoy it.

Retric 18y ago
I salute you. Most people who deal with the darker side of humanity see / learn things they wish they could unsee. But, I suspect your job is far more difficult than most.
- sho 18y ago
  Well I don't salute him at all. Think about what he's doing. He is examining computers for illegal information. An illegal series of bytes. This is utterly insane. You can make up whatever justification you want, but to me the very existence, the very possibility of existence, of illegal information is absolutely, 180˚ opposed to everything I believe in. As far as I am concerned, people like ErrantX are actively working to undermine free society. The fact that many of these illegal files are simply scans of magazines you could apparently buy, completely legally, over the counter, in the 1970s, just adds that last twist of "We have always been at war with Eurasia" doublethink frisson.
  - jpd 18y ago
    Photography is strange; it exists solely to please the eye. One can say that the act of looking at it, is similar to how one would USE other sorts of information, and although that's not quite right either it serves well-enough (in reality intentions matter when talking about this issue, otherwise the cops that verify someone has CP are criminals themselves.) So, that said, it's not the HAVING the information that matters, it's the using of it. If I have your bank account information on my computer it's not illegal for me to have it (I think), but it would certainly give me jail time if I used it to take money out of your account.
  - aditya 18y ago
    Right. And your free society would actually celebrate people that produce and distribute things like child pornography, hell, you'd actually sell your own children into the business, right? I'm sorry but anarchy and freedom from coercion such as taxes are good things that we'd be interested in talking about as hackers, but you're coming out in support of child porn to support your claim of freedom. There is no doublethink here, child porn is wrong, that is objective reality.
    - sho 18y ago
      Wow, you really demolished that straw man you set up there. I'm not advocating child porn, nor anarchy, nor any other of your bizarre projections. Get a grip. "child porn is wrong, that is objective reality." Your proclamations of what is right or wrong have no place in "objective reality", my friend. Objective reality simply is. "you're coming out in support of child porn to support your claim of freedom" Well I didn't really mean to "come out in support of" it but why not, sure, for the sake of argument. And I presume you're "coming out" in favour of a world in which you can be thrown in jail at any time for the existence, on a computer under your control, of a copy of a photo you didn't take?
      - aditya 18y ago
        grin. sorry for sounding annoyed, that wasn't the idea (so much for being objective :) Since you didn't mean to come out in support of child porn (which is what it sounded like you were doing, by proclaiming the government shouldn't be able to go after our bits) - I think it's been determined in this thread that having mistakenly had a copy of a photo on your computer doesn't make you a user, or prosecutable by law. My point was that being associated with Child Pornography (user, distributor, creator) knowing that you're doing it willfully is wrong and should be prosecutable. Now I'm not sure whether we disagree.
- ErrantX 18y ago
  Thank you for saying so :) I dislike getting "sympathy" or "understanding" for my job (not that you've done that). I chose it :D I do my bit and that is it's own reward. I've quite enjoyed chatting about it on here though (I do feel a bit of a cheat that it's earned me nearly 100 Karma in total). You guys have asked much more interesting questions than anyone else does :D
  - jimmyjim 18y ago
    Okay, then I guess you won't mind answering a few questions I have. Down to it, what is so fundamentally wrong with CP? There is no universal consensus of what is beautiful, what is ugly -- the human libido desires whatever it desires; black, white, brown, tall, fat, short, thin, male, female, etc. etc. Why is it a problem that one person prefers the flesh that of the youth? Centuries ago, the traditional relationship actually WAS between one person of considerably older age with one of a significantly younger age. I anticipate the following responses: 1) Because it indirectly creates a demand for CP in general and it is thereby criminal. 2.1) Because it is immoral (religiously, culturally, etc.) 2.2) Because children aren't mature enough to decide for themselves, they should not be involved in CP and adults should not pursue relationships with them. My responses: 1) Which is precisely why it should be made legal. I think it would expunge the market of concretely illegal media. This, in my thinking, is appropriately analogous to the drug situation. If drug X is legalized, the availability of a safer form of drug X would likely appear in market and the impure, dangerous forms of it would naturally cease to circulate (in ideal conditions). OBVIOUSLY I don't condone any physical violence toward anyone. One thing that I CANNOT wrap my head around is BSDM-related porn. And by God, if anyone harms their child, or any other's for that matter, get them some counseling. Pronto. 2) It is decided merely as such by the culture. I take it that the general populace on HN is of atheists -- why then, as atheists, would you shun the the preference of a certain type of body as unnatural, immoral, or illegal? Your thoughts? //Disclaimer: I'm not involved in/with CP in any manner whatsoever, I only believe that it should be "legal" in the same manner free speech is. I believe NOTHING should be censored by ANY governing body, rather, it should be with products and services offered by private entities that CP and other related things should be "blocked for viewing" solely at the behest of the end-user. And yes, then I would encourage any such user to turn that "feature" on to block questionable material. But in the general scheme of things: ZERO CENSORSHIP. //P.S.: Please pardon spelling/grammatical errors, I don't have time to check what I've written. EDIT: HN, please stop downmodding/marking/whatever-you-call-it-here me, it would be against the HN-etiquette as I understand it (downvote for troll behavior, but not for differing opinions). Furthermore, I invite any discussion that goes against what I have said to what I have said. Cheers!