4 ms·

Egyptian court bans YouTube for a month

10 points by 001sky 14y ago

mkhattab 14y ago
I like Hamza Yusuf's take on this matter [1], regarding free speech in the Arab world and in general. I think this is a stupid move on the part of the government. It's making them look like clowns and easily manipulated simpletons. [1]: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE7FZmpVhtA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE7FZmpVhtA
- akamel 14y ago
  Thanks for the link; as a side note, this is not a "move on the part of the government" this is a "move on the part of a court"; chances are this will get appealed and overruled in a higher court!
- diego_moita 14y ago
  I don't. He basically invokes the right of people of being offended and demands this right to be protected by law: anti-defamation laws, anti-desecration laws, anti-racism laws, etc. As a person of Latin American heritage I don't want anyone to be arrested for saying Chicano or Cucaracha. I can handle offenses. Muslims should be able to do the same.
  - mkhattab 14y ago
    I think his main point is that while this country has risen above racial denigration and there are consequences to racial hate speech, there aren't any to religious hate speech. Also, free speech is restricted if it is directed to lead to "imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action" (Brandenburg v. Ohio)[1]. [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States
    - diego_moita 14y ago
      > free speech is restricted Where I live (Brazil) there are, regrettably, a lot more restrictions to free speech than in the U.S.. But I don't think one error is justification for another one. > free speech is restricted if it is directed to lead to "imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action" Ok, I can accept this. But I don't understand how mocking a religion leads to "imminent lawless action".
  - 616c 14y ago
    Agreed. But I think the guy is silly, I would not take him seriously. But when one of my friends, and he is not an exception (just a good writer), wrote an excellent article on the topic, unfortunately in Arabic [1], and the Google Translate version is incomprehensible, you can a better sense of what the very strong opposition to the new regime and this attitude of theirs. In short, his thesis: my Muslim brothers and sisters, we are nothing. I am not going waste time talking more about it more than has already been repeated countless times, but suppose we wake up and all the Muslims are gone. Will scientific research stop? Will any technology and medicine production cease? Will anyone miss Muslim society as a whole for its contributions back? No. And that is what we should worry about. Ironically, he wrote this editorial months ago in reaction to the same video that got YouTube banned very recently. I show this as to not kid the people who come here into thinking Egyptians want censorship and cannot handle the though of someone offending them (this article mocks this viewpoint at length), it is just you must realize English is not the native language (only the ruling elite) or this is huge intellectual movement against most of these things. Unlike the ruling party and more conservative elements, they are focused internally and not externally to work on their image. Take it as you want. [1] http://tahrirnews.com/columns/view.aspx?cdate=19092012&id=e8af4612-e4cf-48c2-ab6b-64468d1ad5df http://tahrirnews.com/columns/view.aspx?cdate=19092012&i...
maeon3 14y ago
“It seems to me a certainty that the fatalistic teachings of Mohammed and the utter degradation of the Arab women are the outstanding causes for the arrested development of the Arab. He is exactly as he was around the year 700, while we have been developing.” -General George S. Patton
- mkhattab 14y ago
  Interesting that you quoted an outspoken racist and anti-semite. I'm guessing you believe in a "clash of civilizations" existential conflict between Muslims and Westerners, right?
  - maeon3 14y ago
    You used a genetic fallacy there, attacking the labels of a person and using that slander as a reason that his statement is wrong. It's like saying my opponent is a muffin-eater, and we all know that muffin eaters are to be despised, so his statement about cats is incorrect. Do you believe that all anti-semites make invalid points about the world? Or is it true that ONLY NON anti-Semitic people can say true things? It doesn't matter if George S Patton just got done eating 15 babies for lunch. His argument stands/falls on its own weight. Attack his argument directly, not make a political attack against his person and dismiss his argument that way. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy
  - 001sky 14y ago
    Interesting that you quoted an outspoken racist and anti-semite -- Have your read the history of 20th Century Warfare?
- 616c 14y ago
  Yeah, quoting a bigot make you look like, well, a bigot. Sincerely, Guy who converted, studied Arabic for 6+ years, has master coursework on Arabic, Islamic studies, Middle East history, and knows this is utter bullshit. And calling an Egyptian an Arab is an insult these days; it is associated with people in the Gulf, and they are not viewed positively, much like a local version of Americans who use their wealth to interfere in local politics and make over generalizations about their interests that they do not understand go figure. Get off my lawn.
camus 14y ago
dont like it ? dont watch it. Nobody forces you to watch that video or to read "Mein Kampf" ( though strangely "Mein Kampf" is a best seller in the arab world , like "the protocol of the elders of zion" ... )

10 points by 001sky 14y ago

I like Hamza Yusuf's take on this matter [1], regarding free speech in the Arab world and in general. I think this is a stupid move on the part of the government. It's making them look like clowns and easily manipulated simpletons. [1]: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE7FZmpVhtA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE7FZmpVhtA

akamel 14y ago
Thanks for the link; as a side note, this is not a "move on the part of the government" this is a "move on the part of a court"; chances are this will get appealed and overruled in a higher court!
diego_moita 14y ago
I don't. He basically invokes the right of people of being offended and demands this right to be protected by law: anti-defamation laws, anti-desecration laws, anti-racism laws, etc. As a person of Latin American heritage I don't want anyone to be arrested for saying Chicano or Cucaracha. I can handle offenses. Muslims should be able to do the same.
- mkhattab 14y ago
  I think his main point is that while this country has risen above racial denigration and there are consequences to racial hate speech, there aren't any to religious hate speech. Also, free speech is restricted if it is directed to lead to "imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action" (Brandenburg v. Ohio)[1]. [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States
  - diego_moita 14y ago
    > free speech is restricted Where I live (Brazil) there are, regrettably, a lot more restrictions to free speech than in the U.S.. But I don't think one error is justification for another one. > free speech is restricted if it is directed to lead to "imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action" Ok, I can accept this. But I don't understand how mocking a religion leads to "imminent lawless action".
- 616c 14y ago
  Agreed. But I think the guy is silly, I would not take him seriously. But when one of my friends, and he is not an exception (just a good writer), wrote an excellent article on the topic, unfortunately in Arabic [1], and the Google Translate version is incomprehensible, you can a better sense of what the very strong opposition to the new regime and this attitude of theirs. In short, his thesis: my Muslim brothers and sisters, we are nothing. I am not going waste time talking more about it more than has already been repeated countless times, but suppose we wake up and all the Muslims are gone. Will scientific research stop? Will any technology and medicine production cease? Will anyone miss Muslim society as a whole for its contributions back? No. And that is what we should worry about. Ironically, he wrote this editorial months ago in reaction to the same video that got YouTube banned very recently. I show this as to not kid the people who come here into thinking Egyptians want censorship and cannot handle the though of someone offending them (this article mocks this viewpoint at length), it is just you must realize English is not the native language (only the ruling elite) or this is huge intellectual movement against most of these things. Unlike the ruling party and more conservative elements, they are focused internally and not externally to work on their image. Take it as you want. [1] http://tahrirnews.com/columns/view.aspx?cdate=19092012&id=e8af4612-e4cf-48c2-ab6b-64468d1ad5df http://tahrirnews.com/columns/view.aspx?cdate=19092012&i...

maeon3 14y ago

“It seems to me a certainty that the fatalistic teachings of Mohammed and the utter degradation of the Arab women are the outstanding causes for the arrested development of the Arab. He is exactly as he was around the year 700, while we have been developing.” -General George S. Patton

mkhattab 14y ago
Interesting that you quoted an outspoken racist and anti-semite. I'm guessing you believe in a "clash of civilizations" existential conflict between Muslims and Westerners, right?
- maeon3 14y ago
  You used a genetic fallacy there, attacking the labels of a person and using that slander as a reason that his statement is wrong. It's like saying my opponent is a muffin-eater, and we all know that muffin eaters are to be despised, so his statement about cats is incorrect. Do you believe that all anti-semites make invalid points about the world? Or is it true that ONLY NON anti-Semitic people can say true things? It doesn't matter if George S Patton just got done eating 15 babies for lunch. His argument stands/falls on its own weight. Attack his argument directly, not make a political attack against his person and dismiss his argument that way. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy
- 001sky 14y ago
  Interesting that you quoted an outspoken racist and anti-semite -- Have your read the history of 20th Century Warfare?
616c 14y ago
Yeah, quoting a bigot make you look like, well, a bigot. Sincerely, Guy who converted, studied Arabic for 6+ years, has master coursework on Arabic, Islamic studies, Middle East history, and knows this is utter bullshit. And calling an Egyptian an Arab is an insult these days; it is associated with people in the Gulf, and they are not viewed positively, much like a local version of Americans who use their wealth to interfere in local politics and make over generalizations about their interests that they do not understand go figure. Get off my lawn.

camus 14y ago

dont like it ? dont watch it. Nobody forces you to watch that video or to read "Mein Kampf" ( though strangely "Mein Kampf" is a best seller in the arab world , like "the protocol of the elders of zion" ... )