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>...it is as close to a true meritocracy it has ever been because the ones with merit rise to the top. And then; >Nobody's saying children of farmers or auto-

by tnuc 14y ago

>...it is as close to a true meritocracy it has ever been because the ones with merit rise to the top. And then; >Nobody's saying children of farmers or auto-mechanics are any less able. They just don't get the best training. So it's a meritocracy but the training isn't available to all? Doesn't sound like a meritocracy to me.

druswick 14y ago
I think the article did a poor job of representing the recent efforts by elite universities to open up access to the children of farmers and auto-mechanics. http://npc.fas.harvard.edu/ http://npc.fas.harvard.edu/ There's still more to be done, sure, but it's important to mention that this isn't as bad as it was even 10 years ago.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- BadCookie 14y ago
  Interesting. I'm the daughter of an electrician. I was admitted to Harvard in 2002, and at that time I believe they wanted my parents to pay about $12,000 for my first year. My parents couldn't afford it, and I did not attend. If that calculator is to be believed, Harvard would now expect less than $3000 from my parents. I probably would have attended had that been the case back then.
  - druswick 14y ago
    I think things changed a lot around 2009? I'm just going by memory... but I think that's when a lot of the ivies drastically changed tuition assistance based on income.
stcredzero 14y ago
> Doesn't sound like a meritocracy to me. Yes, but nothing made out of organized humans ever adheres to mathematically rigorous definition. (1) Our lot is loads better than that of some poor orphan in Haiti, and our opportunities were distributed with tons more equity. That said, it's far from perfect. There are parts of our messy society that are close to meritocracy, and there's other parts that are headache inducing doppelgangers of it. It's a mess, but you can also think of it as opportunity. ((1) - In fact, whenever you think you are about to make a clever or skeptical point in a societally based intellectual discussion, tell yourself this first, then see if you still want to. Same goes for biology and software engineering.)

by tnuc 14y ago

druswick 14y ago

I think the article did a poor job of representing the recent efforts by elite universities to open up access to the children of farmers and auto-mechanics. http://npc.fas.harvard.edu/ http://npc.fas.harvard.edu/ There's still more to be done, sure, but it's important to mention that this isn't as bad as it was even 10 years ago.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
BadCookie 14y ago
Interesting. I'm the daughter of an electrician. I was admitted to Harvard in 2002, and at that time I believe they wanted my parents to pay about $12,000 for my first year. My parents couldn't afford it, and I did not attend. If that calculator is to be believed, Harvard would now expect less than $3000 from my parents. I probably would have attended had that been the case back then.
- druswick 14y ago
  I think things changed a lot around 2009? I'm just going by memory... but I think that's when a lot of the ivies drastically changed tuition assistance based on income.

stcredzero 14y ago

> Doesn't sound like a meritocracy to me. Yes, but nothing made out of organized humans ever adheres to mathematically rigorous definition. (1) Our lot is loads better than that of some poor orphan in Haiti, and our opportunities were distributed with tons more equity. That said, it's far from perfect. There are parts of our messy society that are close to meritocracy, and there's other parts that are headache inducing doppelgangers of it. It's a mess, but you can also think of it as opportunity. ((1) - In fact, whenever you think you are about to make a clever or skeptical point in a societally based intellectual discussion, tell yourself this first, then see if you still want to. Same goes for biology and software engineering.)