6 ms·

Brand new OS, brand new hardware, what could possibly go wrong? Last time they did this (Playbook - new hardware, new OS) it was a gigantic hit, right?

purephase 14y ago
The re-brand is telling. This is not the same organization that launched the PlayBook. I also believe that the PlayBook is an extremely under-valued product. I, and quite a few people I know, use it all the time. For the price point it is a great device.
- serge2k 14y ago
  For the 200 dollar price point. When it launched it was what, twice that? Also came missing basic features. That's what lead to the failure. I got mine as a gift, it's a nice device. Main complaint is no suffort from bigger third party companies (i.e. netflix, skype).
  - Samuel_Michon 14y ago
    The 7" Blackberry PlayBook 16GB cost $499 when it went on sale in April of 2011. That's the same price as Apple was selling its 10" iPad 2 16GB for. Five months later, RIM slashed the prices of the PlayBook. The 16GB model was sold for $199, $6 below the Bill of Materials costs. RIM sold 700,000 PlayBooks before they lowered the prices, and even when they were selling them at a loss, they only managed to sell 1 million more. Aside from its price point, it's not hard to see why the PlayBook flopped. When it launched, there were hardly any third party apps for PlayBook, the OS lacked autocorrection, the onscreen keyboard was barely usable, there was no integration with cloud storage, the default search engine was Bing, it had no store for media content, and of course: it had no standalone e-mail and calendar software.
jmduke 14y ago
So if a company ever messes up then they're doomed to endlessly flounder? Hey, you remember the Apple Lisa?
- freehunter 14y ago
  You've just described how many on HN view Windows Phone. It doesn't matter how good it is, remember how bad it used to be?
  - druiid 14y ago
    And I'd say that's a bit sad. As someone whom uses the WP platform I have to say as far as software goes, MS really developed a great product. Everything just WORKS, whereas with my Android phone it ends up being the platform to 'tinker' with because things randomly crash, or run slow, etc. In my experience WP has been well integrated and there's not really any need to tinker with anything (which I suppose some don't like, but for me I just want my phone to work).
    - freehunter 14y ago
      That's been my experience with WP7 and WP8. It's the platform where you don't need any apps. Everything you expect a smartphone to do comes baked in. The default featureset is quite impressive. Any extra apps are just that, extras. The problem is in getting people to give it a fair go. I hear a lot of iOS and Android complaints that don't exist on WP, and when I bring it up people just laugh.
      - eropple 14y ago
        Honestly? I'd like to like Windows Phone. I really would. I'm not much of a partisan--I switched from iOS to Android not that long ago and still write code for both. But I laugh at Windows Phone 8 because of Windows Phone 7. I simply do not trust Microsoft to not abandon its users again (and as a former XNA user, I distrust them there too).
        freehunter 14y ago
        You honestly can't understand the reason for switching from CE to NT? You honestly expect them to abandon NT for Windows Phone 9? Even still, it's not like Windows Phone 7 users are just up and fucked, they're still receiving updates (like WP7.8). That's good for people who bought into the platform less than two years before WP8 came out; they're not left in the cold. Their apps still work, they can still install many of the new apps coming out, and when they do upgrade (almost all of) their already-purchased apps still work. It's not that Microsoft made a hard cut off and left WP7 users for dead, they're just not providing an OS upgrade from WP7 to WP8. Everything else still works like an incremental upgrade. Windows Phone 7 still works, it's still being updated, and there are still just as many apps being released. And when you get a new phone with WP8, it will work just like WP7 did, and your apps carry over. There's no need to throw a tantrum; no one has been abandoned. This is exactly what I'm talking about: people laugh at the platform with uneducated opinions they tout as fact and spread their "facts" to other people. It ends up being a game of telephone/Chinese whispers where the truth gets more distorted the more its repeated. If you'd really like to like Windows Phone as you say, as a developer or as a user, you might want to think about what you're saying about it first. That app you wrote in 2010 still runs on WP8, and the app you wrote in 2013 works just fine on a WP7 launch device.
eksith 14y ago
I got the Playbook (2 actually, one for my mom) and it's actually pretty good. Considering how much cheaper it was to the Nexus, I don't mind the purchase and for what we really use it for (chat, YouTube, email etc...) it's pretty good. The AppWorld isn't the barren wasteland of shoddy apps it once was either. I think they're slowly starting to attract decent developers.
soperj 14y ago
The OS is an update of the Playbook OS, so not brand new.

purephase 14y ago

The re-brand is telling. This is not the same organization that launched the PlayBook. I also believe that the PlayBook is an extremely under-valued product. I, and quite a few people I know, use it all the time. For the price point it is a great device.

serge2k 14y ago
For the 200 dollar price point. When it launched it was what, twice that? Also came missing basic features. That's what lead to the failure. I got mine as a gift, it's a nice device. Main complaint is no suffort from bigger third party companies (i.e. netflix, skype).
- Samuel_Michon 14y ago
  The 7" Blackberry PlayBook 16GB cost $499 when it went on sale in April of 2011. That's the same price as Apple was selling its 10" iPad 2 16GB for. Five months later, RIM slashed the prices of the PlayBook. The 16GB model was sold for $199, $6 below the Bill of Materials costs. RIM sold 700,000 PlayBooks before they lowered the prices, and even when they were selling them at a loss, they only managed to sell 1 million more. Aside from its price point, it's not hard to see why the PlayBook flopped. When it launched, there were hardly any third party apps for PlayBook, the OS lacked autocorrection, the onscreen keyboard was barely usable, there was no integration with cloud storage, the default search engine was Bing, it had no store for media content, and of course: it had no standalone e-mail and calendar software.

jmduke 14y ago

So if a company ever messes up then they're doomed to endlessly flounder? Hey, you remember the Apple Lisa?

freehunter 14y ago
You've just described how many on HN view Windows Phone. It doesn't matter how good it is, remember how bad it used to be?
- druiid 14y ago
  And I'd say that's a bit sad. As someone whom uses the WP platform I have to say as far as software goes, MS really developed a great product. Everything just WORKS, whereas with my Android phone it ends up being the platform to 'tinker' with because things randomly crash, or run slow, etc. In my experience WP has been well integrated and there's not really any need to tinker with anything (which I suppose some don't like, but for me I just want my phone to work).
  - freehunter 14y ago
    That's been my experience with WP7 and WP8. It's the platform where you don't need any apps. Everything you expect a smartphone to do comes baked in. The default featureset is quite impressive. Any extra apps are just that, extras. The problem is in getting people to give it a fair go. I hear a lot of iOS and Android complaints that don't exist on WP, and when I bring it up people just laugh.
    - eropple 14y ago
      Honestly? I'd like to like Windows Phone. I really would. I'm not much of a partisan--I switched from iOS to Android not that long ago and still write code for both. But I laugh at Windows Phone 8 because of Windows Phone 7. I simply do not trust Microsoft to not abandon its users again (and as a former XNA user, I distrust them there too).
      - freehunter 14y ago
        You honestly can't understand the reason for switching from CE to NT? You honestly expect them to abandon NT for Windows Phone 9? Even still, it's not like Windows Phone 7 users are just up and fucked, they're still receiving updates (like WP7.8). That's good for people who bought into the platform less than two years before WP8 came out; they're not left in the cold. Their apps still work, they can still install many of the new apps coming out, and when they do upgrade (almost all of) their already-purchased apps still work. It's not that Microsoft made a hard cut off and left WP7 users for dead, they're just not providing an OS upgrade from WP7 to WP8. Everything else still works like an incremental upgrade. Windows Phone 7 still works, it's still being updated, and there are still just as many apps being released. And when you get a new phone with WP8, it will work just like WP7 did, and your apps carry over. There's no need to throw a tantrum; no one has been abandoned. This is exactly what I'm talking about: people laugh at the platform with uneducated opinions they tout as fact and spread their "facts" to other people. It ends up being a game of telephone/Chinese whispers where the truth gets more distorted the more its repeated. If you'd really like to like Windows Phone as you say, as a developer or as a user, you might want to think about what you're saying about it first. That app you wrote in 2010 still runs on WP8, and the app you wrote in 2013 works just fine on a WP7 launch device.

eksith 14y ago

I got the Playbook (2 actually, one for my mom) and it's actually pretty good. Considering how much cheaper it was to the Nexus, I don't mind the purchase and for what we really use it for (chat, YouTube, email etc...) it's pretty good. The AppWorld isn't the barren wasteland of shoddy apps it once was either. I think they're slowly starting to attract decent developers.

soperj 14y ago

The OS is an update of the Playbook OS, so not brand new.