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That's what I have always said about law. I can do about 4 hours of legal work a day. Then I am absolutely done. I have no idea how my colleagues can clock in 8

by flexie 14y ago

That's what I have always said about law. I can do about 4 hours of legal work a day. Then I am absolutely done. I have no idea how my colleagues can clock in 8 hours. Yes - there are days I can do more. But there are also days I do less than 4 hours. In the long run I do about 4 hours a day. That's it.

stephengillie 14y ago
Your colleagues likely work 4 like you, then bill for 8. Scott Adams (maker of Dilbert) once said this is extremely common in the corporate world, and my experience largely agrees. Much of the other 4 hours may be spent in meetings, lunches, relocating, gossiping, or internet browsing. You're largely paid to be on-site and aware for 40 hours a week, not to necessarily produce anything. One of Adams' books has a story about someone who took 2 simultaneous jobs at one company. He would show up early on one floor, then take an early lunch and head upstairs to his other job, where they thought he was just arriving late. The employer did eventually catch on, but until then he was paid 16 hours of work for 8 hours of his time.
- mattm 14y ago
  > You're largely paid to be on-site and aware for 40 hours a week, not to necessarily produce anything This really bugged me early on in my career before I understood this. When I started work I would feel disappointed that I couldn't be productive for 8 hours per day. Then I realised that no one else around me was getting probably more than 3 hours of work done in a day so I set my aim for each day at 4 hours of productivity and used a timer to track my concentration time. I still feel conflicted by it though. When I was freelancing, I tried doubling my rate with the expectation that I would only work 20 hours per week. I think most people thought I was lazy and wouldn't go for it. Hopefully in the future we'll be able to move away from the idea that a 40+ hour work week is ideal.
  - analog 14y ago
    You have to frame your rate in terms that demonstrate the value you'll be providing. Eg you could say you'll only be working 20 billable hours per week and suddenly it sounds like they will be getting some of your time for free. The rest of the time is actually taken up with marketing, administration, training etc.
    - stephengillie 14y ago
      Don't forget that some clients value face time. Sometimes I wonder if a client is just paying me to be around him...
      - vidarh 14y ago
        I did contracting for some short stints when I was younger, and quickly realised that this was it. I could quote a fixed price for some work, and they'd readily accept my rates. But if I then would try to leave after the amount of time the work actually took me, they'd question whether or not I was actually doing the job properly. So I quoted even higher on the expectation that 1) I'd have to sit in a chair in their office 8 hours a day and so couldn't do other work elsewhere and needed to be compensated extra for that inconvenience, 2) I'd be bored out of my mind trying to fill the rest of the time I was there. Never a question raised. It was frustrating. Especially one job where I as stuck for 3 weeks on a machine with no internet connection doing a job I could easily finish with 2 hours every day. Whenever possible I'd work remotely.
  - pseut 14y ago
    This might be another reason to bill by the week instead of by the hour when freelancing.
- yuhong 14y ago
  Reminds me of this: http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/45776/why-do-business-analysts-and-project-managers-get-higher-salaries-than-programme http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/45776/why-do-...

by flexie 14y ago

stephengillie 14y ago

Your colleagues likely work 4 like you, then bill for 8. Scott Adams (maker of Dilbert) once said this is extremely common in the corporate world, and my experience largely agrees. Much of the other 4 hours may be spent in meetings, lunches, relocating, gossiping, or internet browsing. You're largely paid to be on-site and aware for 40 hours a week, not to necessarily produce anything. One of Adams' books has a story about someone who took 2 simultaneous jobs at one company. He would show up early on one floor, then take an early lunch and head upstairs to his other job, where they thought he was just arriving late. The employer did eventually catch on, but until then he was paid 16 hours of work for 8 hours of his time.

mattm 14y ago
> You're largely paid to be on-site and aware for 40 hours a week, not to necessarily produce anything This really bugged me early on in my career before I understood this. When I started work I would feel disappointed that I couldn't be productive for 8 hours per day. Then I realised that no one else around me was getting probably more than 3 hours of work done in a day so I set my aim for each day at 4 hours of productivity and used a timer to track my concentration time. I still feel conflicted by it though. When I was freelancing, I tried doubling my rate with the expectation that I would only work 20 hours per week. I think most people thought I was lazy and wouldn't go for it. Hopefully in the future we'll be able to move away from the idea that a 40+ hour work week is ideal.
- analog 14y ago
  You have to frame your rate in terms that demonstrate the value you'll be providing. Eg you could say you'll only be working 20 billable hours per week and suddenly it sounds like they will be getting some of your time for free. The rest of the time is actually taken up with marketing, administration, training etc.
  - stephengillie 14y ago
    Don't forget that some clients value face time. Sometimes I wonder if a client is just paying me to be around him...
    - vidarh 14y ago
      I did contracting for some short stints when I was younger, and quickly realised that this was it. I could quote a fixed price for some work, and they'd readily accept my rates. But if I then would try to leave after the amount of time the work actually took me, they'd question whether or not I was actually doing the job properly. So I quoted even higher on the expectation that 1) I'd have to sit in a chair in their office 8 hours a day and so couldn't do other work elsewhere and needed to be compensated extra for that inconvenience, 2) I'd be bored out of my mind trying to fill the rest of the time I was there. Never a question raised. It was frustrating. Especially one job where I as stuck for 3 weeks on a machine with no internet connection doing a job I could easily finish with 2 hours every day. Whenever possible I'd work remotely.
- pseut 14y ago
  This might be another reason to bill by the week instead of by the hour when freelancing.
yuhong 14y ago
Reminds me of this: http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/45776/why-do-business-analysts-and-project-managers-get-higher-salaries-than-programme http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/45776/why-do-...