4 ms·

I have an ergonomic keyboard (maltron) and a standing table. Both are not exactly portable. In any case, I highly recommend NOT to work on your laptop's keyboa

by urlwolf 14y ago

I have an ergonomic keyboard (maltron) and a standing table. Both are not exactly portable. In any case, I highly recommend NOT to work on your laptop's keyboard. It's a sure recipe to screw up your hands.

kops 14y ago
>> It's a sure recipe to screw up your hands. I learnt that the hard way and the only thing that helped afterwards was an ergonomic keyboard. For those who don't know, the wrist injury (RSI) is excruciatingly painful and will most likely offset any productivity gains you might have made earlier. Back to the article, I don't quite understand that how "fewer distractions" can immediately be followed by "socializing and meeting new people". Edit : typo
robomartin 14y ago
Many years ago, when I was coding 16 hours a day with regularity, I suffered from horrible carpal tunnel pain on both wrists. My solution was two-fold. First, I threw away the mouse and switched to a thumb-operated trackball (Logitech or Microsoft). Second, I designed and fabricated my own desk. The easiest way to describe it is that this desk has a cavity into which the keyboard and trackball fit. With this design my wrists were fully supported and my hands drooped into the cavity to naturally make contact with the keyboard and trackball. This worked wonders. I took a two week break from coding while designing and fabricating this desk (MIG welding and woodwork). By the time I was done the inflammation on my wrists was gone. I went back to coding long hours. The pain never came back and neither did the inflammation.
- kordless 14y ago
  > coding 16 hours a day I think you had bigger problems than with your wrists! We've all got to live life first. Work second. Everything in moderation my friend!
  - robomartin 14y ago
    Different time, different place. I won't do that now. Haven't done it in years.
- iyulaev 14y ago
  This reminds me of one thing I don't understand - keyboards that tilt up towards you. I find that wrists elevated and flat or slightly down is most comfortable, and the tilted keyboards cause me to bend my wrists up in an awkward way. Who decided that this was a good idea? The cavity desk sounds like a more extreme version of the genal posture I find most comfortable.
  - robomartin 14y ago
    > This reminds me of one thing I don't understand - keyboards that tilt up towards you. Yes! Absolutely. They are HORRIBLE for your wrists. I don't get them either.
- freehunter 14y ago
  I was worried about carpal tunnel so I switched to a thumb trackball as well, but then I ran into a different problem. I started noticing pain in my thumb, far worse than the pain in my wrists had been. I was losing mobility in my thumb, and it became swollen and incredibly painful to move under any circumstance. I put the trackball in a drawer and started using my Thinkpad's mouse nub, and the pain in my thumb went away (though I am still concerned about carpal tunnel). I haven't heard of this happening to anyone else, but in my experience trackballs can do just as much damage as a normal mouse, just to different joints. Now I use a trackball at home (occasional usage) and the nub when I'm working (heavier usage). The real key I've found to avoid repetitive stress injuries is to avoid repetitive movements of any kind. Seems kinda obvious now.
  - robomartin 14y ago
    A few thoughts: A good quality trackball with super-low friction is fundamental. I've had trackballs that developed pain on my thumb, just like you stated, very quickly. These were usually mechanical. The optical trackballs can be wonderful. Both Logitech and MS make good ones. You have to keep them clean. Again, it's about super-low friction. You should have almost no resistance to moving the ball. Don't just move with your thumb. I developed into moving the trackball with elbow, wrist and thumb-centered motions. In general terms, I think I only use the thumb knuckle-originated motion for when accurate positioning is required, for example, while using a CAD program. Keyboard shortcuts rule. I don't have a metric for how much I use the mouse, but if I am doing anything repetitive I figure out the keyboard shortcuts or write keyboard macros. One example is in repeating operations in Photoshop. I learned that you need the correct posture and kinematics in order to relax. This is where my "cavity desk" worked wonders. It made me aware of when I was tensing-up almost any part of my arm, all the way up to my shoulders. If you work extended hours there's no escaping the need to learn to be very relaxed. A standard desk absolutely sucks for computer use, no matter who makes it. They are designed for writing with pen and paper and that's it. Your wrists end-up angled upwards on both your keyboard and mouse or trackball. With a cavity and an adjustable chair your forearms are horizontal, your wrist is horizontal and your fingers very naturally droop onto the keyboard or trackball. That, as a combination, is what I think make a huge difference for me and could for others.
nicholassmith 14y ago
I used to suffer from RSI quite badly but since I've taken to using my laptop more it's not been a problem. Typing on crappy desk keyboards seems to cause me more problems than my Macbook keyboard.

by urlwolf 14y ago

kops 14y ago

>> It's a sure recipe to screw up your hands. I learnt that the hard way and the only thing that helped afterwards was an ergonomic keyboard. For those who don't know, the wrist injury (RSI) is excruciatingly painful and will most likely offset any productivity gains you might have made earlier. Back to the article, I don't quite understand that how "fewer distractions" can immediately be followed by "socializing and meeting new people". Edit : typo

robomartin 14y ago

Many years ago, when I was coding 16 hours a day with regularity, I suffered from horrible carpal tunnel pain on both wrists. My solution was two-fold. First, I threw away the mouse and switched to a thumb-operated trackball (Logitech or Microsoft). Second, I designed and fabricated my own desk. The easiest way to describe it is that this desk has a cavity into which the keyboard and trackball fit. With this design my wrists were fully supported and my hands drooped into the cavity to naturally make contact with the keyboard and trackball. This worked wonders. I took a two week break from coding while designing and fabricating this desk (MIG welding and woodwork). By the time I was done the inflammation on my wrists was gone. I went back to coding long hours. The pain never came back and neither did the inflammation.

kordless 14y ago
> coding 16 hours a day I think you had bigger problems than with your wrists! We've all got to live life first. Work second. Everything in moderation my friend!
- robomartin 14y ago
  Different time, different place. I won't do that now. Haven't done it in years.
iyulaev 14y ago
This reminds me of one thing I don't understand - keyboards that tilt up towards you. I find that wrists elevated and flat or slightly down is most comfortable, and the tilted keyboards cause me to bend my wrists up in an awkward way. Who decided that this was a good idea? The cavity desk sounds like a more extreme version of the genal posture I find most comfortable.
- robomartin 14y ago
  > This reminds me of one thing I don't understand - keyboards that tilt up towards you. Yes! Absolutely. They are HORRIBLE for your wrists. I don't get them either.
freehunter 14y ago
I was worried about carpal tunnel so I switched to a thumb trackball as well, but then I ran into a different problem. I started noticing pain in my thumb, far worse than the pain in my wrists had been. I was losing mobility in my thumb, and it became swollen and incredibly painful to move under any circumstance. I put the trackball in a drawer and started using my Thinkpad's mouse nub, and the pain in my thumb went away (though I am still concerned about carpal tunnel). I haven't heard of this happening to anyone else, but in my experience trackballs can do just as much damage as a normal mouse, just to different joints. Now I use a trackball at home (occasional usage) and the nub when I'm working (heavier usage). The real key I've found to avoid repetitive stress injuries is to avoid repetitive movements of any kind. Seems kinda obvious now.
- robomartin 14y ago
  A few thoughts: A good quality trackball with super-low friction is fundamental. I've had trackballs that developed pain on my thumb, just like you stated, very quickly. These were usually mechanical. The optical trackballs can be wonderful. Both Logitech and MS make good ones. You have to keep them clean. Again, it's about super-low friction. You should have almost no resistance to moving the ball. Don't just move with your thumb. I developed into moving the trackball with elbow, wrist and thumb-centered motions. In general terms, I think I only use the thumb knuckle-originated motion for when accurate positioning is required, for example, while using a CAD program. Keyboard shortcuts rule. I don't have a metric for how much I use the mouse, but if I am doing anything repetitive I figure out the keyboard shortcuts or write keyboard macros. One example is in repeating operations in Photoshop. I learned that you need the correct posture and kinematics in order to relax. This is where my "cavity desk" worked wonders. It made me aware of when I was tensing-up almost any part of my arm, all the way up to my shoulders. If you work extended hours there's no escaping the need to learn to be very relaxed. A standard desk absolutely sucks for computer use, no matter who makes it. They are designed for writing with pen and paper and that's it. Your wrists end-up angled upwards on both your keyboard and mouse or trackball. With a cavity and an adjustable chair your forearms are horizontal, your wrist is horizontal and your fingers very naturally droop onto the keyboard or trackball. That, as a combination, is what I think make a huge difference for me and could for others.

nicholassmith 14y ago

I used to suffer from RSI quite badly but since I've taken to using my laptop more it's not been a problem. Typing on crappy desk keyboards seems to cause me more problems than my Macbook keyboard.