4 ms·

This blog post is wonderfully written; it succinctly outlines the benefits and the caveats from both the employer and the employee's perspective. "I’ll let you

This blog post is wonderfully written; it succinctly outlines the benefits and the caveats from both the employer and the employee's perspective. "I’ll let you in on a secret: most of our remote developers work longer hours than our in-office devs." This reminds me of the 'unlimited vacation' policy, which, if I'm not mistaken has effectively showed that employees don't end up taking as many days off as they would if they were allotted the standard 15/20 days. I generally feel that when you empower an employee, and give them ownership and responsibility, provided that they're passionate and capable, you'll see significant productivity gains. In the case of SE, this holds true because the problem that they're solving is so close to the creators of the product.

overgryphon 14y ago
I'm not sure "unlimited" vacation time is empowering. It makes who goes on vacation more or less than whoever else something that may be silently judged. Bob went abroad for five weeks- is that excessive? Bob has no way of knowing what others will think, and may not go abroad at all to avoid the potential fallout. This judgment is also very difficult to uncover- if one person discourages his team from taking vacation, how would you tell? With allotted vacation times, HR tracks whether a specific manager's employee's are taking vacation. More importantly the lack of vacation time accounting provides less protection for the employee in terms of job loss. Unused vacation time is often added to severance pay. In actual practice, "unlimited vacation" seems to be a nice term for the company to minimize potential severance pay, bookkeeping, and potentially create a work environment that silently discourages taking vacation time while publicizing the opposite.
- jaggederest 14y ago
  > In actual practice, "unlimited vacation" seems to be a nice term for the company to minimize potential severance pay, bookkeeping, and potentially create a work environment that silently discourages taking vacation time while publicizing the opposite. I too have been bitten by this - hearing "there is no vacation time limit", and then seeing your paycheck shrink and being told "You took too much vacation"... That's extremely negative for morale. I wish that companies had a minimum vacation time, but no maximum besides "your work isn't getting done".
  - jaimebuelta 14y ago
    Curiously, in Europe we have a required minimum number of days of vacation a year (20). I had been remembered several times by HR in different companies that I HAVE TO take those days off before the end of the year (around November or so).
- nirvanatikku 14y ago
  I wasn't trying to make that assertion, actually. Maybe I wasn't all that clear, but my first point with regards to unlimited vaca policy is that even though it seems to be giving individuals freedom (like working from home can be seen to be), it doesn't always turn out that way in practice -- people are more likely to end up working more for whatever reason (inline with what you've articulated well above). I'm all for allotted days. My second point was a general thought. The appreciation I have for SO is undoubtedly shared across the tech community; the SE platform has changed how we (not just techies) learn. I believe that they are an exception to the rule and that their ethos teases the best out of engineers. As knowledge workers we have our greatest impact in our distraction-free flow state. If work is good, higher output is natural. With the right environment, a remote situation could possibly enable me to stay in the zone more.
- eli_gottlieb 14y ago
  It makes who goes on vacation more or less than whoever else something that may be silently judged. Bob went abroad for five weeks- is that excessive? Bob has no way of knowing what others will think, and may not go abroad at all to avoid the potential fallout. Why is a team full of grown men, mature adults, silently judging a team member for doing something the rules entitle them to do? /armor-piercing-question

overgryphon 14y ago

I'm not sure "unlimited" vacation time is empowering. It makes who goes on vacation more or less than whoever else something that may be silently judged. Bob went abroad for five weeks- is that excessive? Bob has no way of knowing what others will think, and may not go abroad at all to avoid the potential fallout. This judgment is also very difficult to uncover- if one person discourages his team from taking vacation, how would you tell? With allotted vacation times, HR tracks whether a specific manager's employee's are taking vacation. More importantly the lack of vacation time accounting provides less protection for the employee in terms of job loss. Unused vacation time is often added to severance pay. In actual practice, "unlimited vacation" seems to be a nice term for the company to minimize potential severance pay, bookkeeping, and potentially create a work environment that silently discourages taking vacation time while publicizing the opposite.

jaggederest 14y ago
> In actual practice, "unlimited vacation" seems to be a nice term for the company to minimize potential severance pay, bookkeeping, and potentially create a work environment that silently discourages taking vacation time while publicizing the opposite. I too have been bitten by this - hearing "there is no vacation time limit", and then seeing your paycheck shrink and being told "You took too much vacation"... That's extremely negative for morale. I wish that companies had a minimum vacation time, but no maximum besides "your work isn't getting done".
- jaimebuelta 14y ago
  Curiously, in Europe we have a required minimum number of days of vacation a year (20). I had been remembered several times by HR in different companies that I HAVE TO take those days off before the end of the year (around November or so).
nirvanatikku 14y ago
I wasn't trying to make that assertion, actually. Maybe I wasn't all that clear, but my first point with regards to unlimited vaca policy is that even though it seems to be giving individuals freedom (like working from home can be seen to be), it doesn't always turn out that way in practice -- people are more likely to end up working more for whatever reason (inline with what you've articulated well above). I'm all for allotted days. My second point was a general thought. The appreciation I have for SO is undoubtedly shared across the tech community; the SE platform has changed how we (not just techies) learn. I believe that they are an exception to the rule and that their ethos teases the best out of engineers. As knowledge workers we have our greatest impact in our distraction-free flow state. If work is good, higher output is natural. With the right environment, a remote situation could possibly enable me to stay in the zone more.
eli_gottlieb 14y ago
It makes who goes on vacation more or less than whoever else something that may be silently judged. Bob went abroad for five weeks- is that excessive? Bob has no way of knowing what others will think, and may not go abroad at all to avoid the potential fallout. Why is a team full of grown men, mature adults, silently judging a team member for doing something the rules entitle them to do? /armor-piercing-question