4 ms·

There's also 25% VAT, compared to 0%-8% sales tax in the US (varying by state). I'm not sure why included university attendance is always thrown into the pitch

There's also 25% VAT, compared to 0%-8% sales tax in the US (varying by state). I'm not sure why included university attendance is always thrown into the pitch in these conversations -- someone looking for a place to work probably isn't trying to pick up a philosophy degree on the side.

tow21 14y ago
Because if you're not a single 20-something, you might be thinking about saving for your children's education. Being sited in a country with free university education means that when you're paying your staff, you don't have to assume that they need to be putting away several thousand a year for a college fund.
- rb12345 14y ago
  It would also mean that people who are 20-something and educated locally are less likely to have large student loans to repay too. They would pay more tax compared to the US, but need to spend less money after tax so it should even itself out.
  - tephra 14y ago
    This is not necisarilly true. As a student in Sweden I can explain how our system works. The university is free for swedes and europeans (might only be free for schengen countries). In Sweden we have a government agency that controlls student loans and subsidies (the agency is called CSN, Central Study Board). As a Swedish citizen you have the right to a ~2000 SEK (around 300 USD) per month subsidy. So just by attending university you get 2k SEK each month (this is limited to I think 12 terms in total, i.e 6 years), this is something you don't have you pay back. We then also have the right to a student loan which will push up your monthly "earnings" to ~8000 SEK (1200 USD). This loan you obviously have to pay back. The current plan is that every student that took a loan before 2001 have 25 years to repay it. Students that live at home during the duration of their study time can get away with only taking the subsidy. But most student (at least those that I know, including me) have to take the student loan.
    - _delirium 14y ago
      Interesting, that's something that's different in Denmark. The Statens Uddannelsesstøtte (SU) is 5500 DKK (around 1000 USD) per month. You can additionally take loans, but most students don't; they just live within the SU amount, often by living in one of the fairly cheap university dorms. It's getting more common for students to supplement their SU with freelancing or a 1-day-a-week job, though, especially masters students in areas like tech or design.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
jonmartin 14y ago
Regarding Helsinki, ignoring deductions an income of $100,000 (€73,000) would be taxed at 36% with everything included (pension contributions and so forth). You can check yourself at http://prosentti.vero.fi/VPL2013/Sivut/Aloitus.aspx?kieli=en-US http://prosentti.vero.fi/VPL2013/Sivut/Aloitus.aspx?kieli=en... Healthcare is basically free (trivial costs for a visit) and that's for everyone with a work permit, no exceptions. VAT is 24% and food is expensive. Salaries are lower than other big cities but not much and it depends a lot on the exchange rate if making a comparison. When the dollar was getting you €0.63 our salaries looked fine; at €0.73 they look a bit light.
Mvandenbergh 14y ago
Agreed, but if you're spending 5-10% of your income every month on repaying student loans that has the same effect as a tax. I think the cost of healthcare is a much better example though.

tow21 14y ago

Because if you're not a single 20-something, you might be thinking about saving for your children's education. Being sited in a country with free university education means that when you're paying your staff, you don't have to assume that they need to be putting away several thousand a year for a college fund.

rb12345 14y ago
It would also mean that people who are 20-something and educated locally are less likely to have large student loans to repay too. They would pay more tax compared to the US, but need to spend less money after tax so it should even itself out.
- tephra 14y ago
  This is not necisarilly true. As a student in Sweden I can explain how our system works. The university is free for swedes and europeans (might only be free for schengen countries). In Sweden we have a government agency that controlls student loans and subsidies (the agency is called CSN, Central Study Board). As a Swedish citizen you have the right to a ~2000 SEK (around 300 USD) per month subsidy. So just by attending university you get 2k SEK each month (this is limited to I think 12 terms in total, i.e 6 years), this is something you don't have you pay back. We then also have the right to a student loan which will push up your monthly "earnings" to ~8000 SEK (1200 USD). This loan you obviously have to pay back. The current plan is that every student that took a loan before 2001 have 25 years to repay it. Students that live at home during the duration of their study time can get away with only taking the subsidy. But most student (at least those that I know, including me) have to take the student loan.
  - _delirium 14y ago
    Interesting, that's something that's different in Denmark. The Statens Uddannelsesstøtte (SU) is 5500 DKK (around 1000 USD) per month. You can additionally take loans, but most students don't; they just live within the SU amount, often by living in one of the fairly cheap university dorms. It's getting more common for students to supplement their SU with freelancing or a 1-day-a-week job, though, especially masters students in areas like tech or design.

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

jonmartin 14y ago

Regarding Helsinki, ignoring deductions an income of $100,000 (€73,000) would be taxed at 36% with everything included (pension contributions and so forth). You can check yourself at http://prosentti.vero.fi/VPL2013/Sivut/Aloitus.aspx?kieli=en-US http://prosentti.vero.fi/VPL2013/Sivut/Aloitus.aspx?kieli=en... Healthcare is basically free (trivial costs for a visit) and that's for everyone with a work permit, no exceptions. VAT is 24% and food is expensive. Salaries are lower than other big cities but not much and it depends a lot on the exchange rate if making a comparison. When the dollar was getting you €0.63 our salaries looked fine; at €0.73 they look a bit light.

Mvandenbergh 14y ago

Agreed, but if you're spending 5-10% of your income every month on repaying student loans that has the same effect as a tax. I think the cost of healthcare is a much better example though.