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"Making the world open"? Facebook doesn't even offer RSS feeds, so thanks for the chuckle. "Making the world connected"? The world is connected anyway, introduc

"Making the world open"? Facebook doesn't even offer RSS feeds, so thanks for the chuckle. "Making the world connected"? The world is connected anyway, introducing middlemen into it makes it arguably less connected, that is, it introduces more connectedness that sucks, instead of the kind that doesn't. Thanks for honing my doublethink radar or something.

msoad 14y ago
> Facebook's mission is to make the world more open and connected.
freshfunk 14y ago
1B people disagree with you.
- pdonis 14y ago
  1B people aren't even asking themselves those questions.
  - freshfunk 14y ago
    If people didn't think FB was making things more open and connected, then why are they even on the site (and returning frequently)? It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family.
    - neumann_alfred 14y ago
      It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family. And that is relevant how, exactly? Even if it was: 6B people are NOT using it.
      - freshfunk 14y ago
        A good majority of that is in China where the govt has banned it. Show me a service that's connected more people that hasn't been around for more than 20 years and not named "the Internet." The greatest value FB brings is making it easier to connect and share (ie. be open) with others and 1B people derive enough value in that to come back on a regular basis. That's the point.
    - pdonis 14y ago
      clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family. Which they would be doing anyway if FB didn't exist. FB to them is convenience, nothing more. Many of them probably think that FB is "the Internet", just as many AOL users thought that in the 90's. They are only "connected" inside the walled garden; they have no idea of all the things that are outside it.
      - freshfunk 14y ago
        Wow that's pretty condescending. Yes, it is a convenience... Much like email is a convenience over snail mail and Face Time is a convenience over meeting in person. Arguably the car is a "convenience" over the horse. Discounting the breakthrough in technology that spawned the term "social networking" doesn't really help your position. AOL may be a defunct company but in their hey day they brought millions of people online. They deserve more than your mockery.
        pdonis 14y ago
        I didn't say there was no value in convenience. Of course there is. I use email. I'm posting here instead of xeroxing and snail mailing what I write. But HN isn't trying to monetize my personal information, and it isn't trying to be my only portal to the Internet. Yes, AOL in its heyday brought lots of people online--and made them think that going through AOL was the only way to get online. Facebook has brought a lot of people social networking--and has made them think that allowing Facebook to monetize their private information is the only way to do social networking. They are encouraging people to choose short-term convenience at the expense of long-term control over their own data and their own online lives. My point is that saying "lots of people use Facebook" is not the same thing as saying "Facebook is doing things that are good for its users, or the Internet, or society, all things considered". Same for s/Facebook/AOL/.
    - npsimons 14y ago
      Because they don't give a shit about openness and connectedness, all they care about is gossiping with/about their friends and drama.
  - freshfunk 14y ago
    If people didn't think FB was making things more open and connected, then why are they even on the site (and returning frequently)? It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family.
- hayksaakian 14y ago
  "Do you want to post this comment to your Facebook timeline?" [ Yes ] [ in 1 minute ]
- pavanky 14y ago
  More than a Billion people disagree on pretty much anything.
- neumann_alfred 14y ago
  Not having much of a thought either way doesn't exactly count as disagreeing in my books. And even if that wasn't true: the arguments matter, not the amount of people that hold a certain opinion.
- Luyt 14y ago
  Ah, "If many believe so, it is so", the Argumentum Ad Populum [1]. In Roman times, 1 million people believed that you could foretell the future by 'reading' the entrails of animals. That so many people believed this, doesn't make it necessary a reliable way to predict the future ;-) [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_populum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_populum
mcpherrinm 14y ago
Open and Connected doesn't mean what you think it does. That's not a statement about technology. RSS feeds? They're building a product for the masses. They just want to log in and connect with friends, share with them, and gawk at pictures of their friends. "Open" doesn't mean in the neckbeard sense. "Connected" isn't about how many protocols they support. Building RSS support would be a distraction. They have support for applications that could probably give you that -- I'm not sure because I've never wanted it. As Zuck said in Time Magazine, "Open means having access to more information, right? More transparency, being able to share things and have a voice in the world. And connected is helping people stay in touch and maintain empathy for each other, and bandwidth."[1] Complaining about Facebook being a walled garden is a valid point. But complaining that it's doublethink is not. 1: http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2036683_2037183_2037185-7,00.html http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2...
- neumann_alfred 14y ago
  Complaining about Facebook being a walled garden is a valid point. But complaining that it's doublethink is not. Okay, so there's more openness and transparency within that walled garden, and that's why it's not doublethink, gotcha. "Open" just "doesn't mean what I think it means", which is a perfectly valid thing to say, while it would of course invalid to claim "open means something else than you or Zuckerberg seem to think".
- d0mine 14y ago
  If it is "open" can I search for it on google?

msoad 14y ago

> Facebook's mission is to make the world more open and connected.

freshfunk 14y ago

1B people disagree with you.

pdonis 14y ago
1B people aren't even asking themselves those questions.
- freshfunk 14y ago
  If people didn't think FB was making things more open and connected, then why are they even on the site (and returning frequently)? It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family.
  - neumann_alfred 14y ago
    It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family. And that is relevant how, exactly? Even if it was: 6B people are NOT using it.
    - freshfunk 14y ago
      A good majority of that is in China where the govt has banned it. Show me a service that's connected more people that hasn't been around for more than 20 years and not named "the Internet." The greatest value FB brings is making it easier to connect and share (ie. be open) with others and 1B people derive enough value in that to come back on a regular basis. That's the point.
  - pdonis 14y ago
    clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family. Which they would be doing anyway if FB didn't exist. FB to them is convenience, nothing more. Many of them probably think that FB is "the Internet", just as many AOL users thought that in the 90's. They are only "connected" inside the walled garden; they have no idea of all the things that are outside it.
    - freshfunk 14y ago
      Wow that's pretty condescending. Yes, it is a convenience... Much like email is a convenience over snail mail and Face Time is a convenience over meeting in person. Arguably the car is a "convenience" over the horse. Discounting the breakthrough in technology that spawned the term "social networking" doesn't really help your position. AOL may be a defunct company but in their hey day they brought millions of people online. They deserve more than your mockery.
      - pdonis 14y ago
        I didn't say there was no value in convenience. Of course there is. I use email. I'm posting here instead of xeroxing and snail mailing what I write. But HN isn't trying to monetize my personal information, and it isn't trying to be my only portal to the Internet. Yes, AOL in its heyday brought lots of people online--and made them think that going through AOL was the only way to get online. Facebook has brought a lot of people social networking--and has made them think that allowing Facebook to monetize their private information is the only way to do social networking. They are encouraging people to choose short-term convenience at the expense of long-term control over their own data and their own online lives. My point is that saying "lots of people use Facebook" is not the same thing as saying "Facebook is doing things that are good for its users, or the Internet, or society, all things considered". Same for s/Facebook/AOL/.
  - npsimons 14y ago
    Because they don't give a shit about openness and connectedness, all they care about is gossiping with/about their friends and drama.
- freshfunk 14y ago
  If people didn't think FB was making things more open and connected, then why are they even on the site (and returning frequently)? It may not be YOUR narrow definition of open and connected but clearly they are deriving value from connecting and sharing with their friends and family.
hayksaakian 14y ago
"Do you want to post this comment to your Facebook timeline?" [ Yes ] [ in 1 minute ]
pavanky 14y ago
More than a Billion people disagree on pretty much anything.
neumann_alfred 14y ago
Not having much of a thought either way doesn't exactly count as disagreeing in my books. And even if that wasn't true: the arguments matter, not the amount of people that hold a certain opinion.
Luyt 14y ago
Ah, "If many believe so, it is so", the Argumentum Ad Populum [1]. In Roman times, 1 million people believed that you could foretell the future by 'reading' the entrails of animals. That so many people believed this, doesn't make it necessary a reliable way to predict the future ;-) [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_populum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_populum

mcpherrinm 14y ago

Open and Connected doesn't mean what you think it does. That's not a statement about technology. RSS feeds? They're building a product for the masses. They just want to log in and connect with friends, share with them, and gawk at pictures of their friends. "Open" doesn't mean in the neckbeard sense. "Connected" isn't about how many protocols they support. Building RSS support would be a distraction. They have support for applications that could probably give you that -- I'm not sure because I've never wanted it. As Zuck said in Time Magazine, "Open means having access to more information, right? More transparency, being able to share things and have a voice in the world. And connected is helping people stay in touch and maintain empathy for each other, and bandwidth."[1] Complaining about Facebook being a walled garden is a valid point. But complaining that it's doublethink is not. 1: http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2036683_2037183_2037185-7,00.html http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2...

neumann_alfred 14y ago
Complaining about Facebook being a walled garden is a valid point. But complaining that it's doublethink is not. Okay, so there's more openness and transparency within that walled garden, and that's why it's not doublethink, gotcha. "Open" just "doesn't mean what I think it means", which is a perfectly valid thing to say, while it would of course invalid to claim "open means something else than you or Zuckerberg seem to think".
d0mine 14y ago
If it is "open" can I search for it on google?