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HN's collective reading comprehension seems to have dipped lately. Fortunately, pg is usually concise enough that we can use this as an exercise: "Maybe before

HN's collective reading comprehension seems to have dipped lately. Fortunately, pg is usually concise enough that we can use this as an exercise: "Maybe before..." "before" merely implies order. It does not mean "instead of". It means, "this first, then that." "...federal prosecutors are unsympathetic assholes..." The subject here is not jail sentences or felony convictions or legal antics. The subject here is sympathy. For example, a statement made on HN which would fit pg's subject is, "federal prosecutors had no sympathy for...". "...we should start by examining our own community." The implication here is that our own community is also often unsympathetic and full of assholish behavior. pg was not comparing public ridicule and hurt feelings to death, prison, or felony convictions. He was only suggesting that one of the complaints here over Aaron's case has been that the prosecutors were "unsympathetic", even though our own community is also unsympathetic. I have no idea how you could have misinterpreted a single statement of 24 words that badly.

jakebellacera 14y ago
jcampbell1 and pg are bringing up a conversation from a another thread: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5110270 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5110270.
- thaumaturgy 14y ago
  Hmm. pg and jcampbell1's comments predate that thread by several hours, and I don't see the connection anyway. Did you link the wrong thread, or am I missing something?
jcampbell1 14y ago
I was mainly making a joke, but the content of the statement was a problem. Let's consider the relative merits and priorities of "spending time complaining about federal prosecutors" vs. "examining our own community". The former is about trying to change our society to make it more just, the latter is aimless introspection. The comment was a bit of a troll and not insightful so I trolled back. If this were not pg's website, I am certain you wouldn't be defending the statement because it lacks substance.
- thaumaturgy 14y ago
  > The former is about trying to change our society to make it more just, the latter is aimless introspection. On the contrary, the former is something we probably won't change [1], while the latter is almost certainly something we can change. > The comment was a bit of a troll and not insightful so I trolled back. If this were not pg's website, I am certain you wouldn't be defending the statement because it lacks substance. I seriously doubt he was trolling, and you shouldn't be so certain. This being pg's site is completely irrelevant in this case [2]; I'm simply ... actually, disgusted is about the best adjective I can think of to describe how I feel about the nonsense arguments on HN lately. People seem to be in some kind of a hurry to disagree, because they aren't actually reading and comprehending what other people are writing, they aren't stopping for a moment to consider that perhaps the person they're responding to isn't an idiot or a troll, they aren't maintaining basic principles of civility, they're commenting on (and arguing about!) subjects that are way outside their expertise, and they seem to be nearly drooling at the chance to engage in a witch hunt. For example, nothing in my reply was a defense of pg's statement. Nothing. Not a single word. The entirety of my reply was a tutorial on high school level reading comprehension and a snide remark about HN (well, and a question about you). So, how is it that you interpreted that as a defense of his statement? -- [1]: I may yet be pleasantly surprised. I certainly wouldn't've guessed at how much press the Aaron Swartz case would end up getting, and there is some small chance now that it might end up causing some kind of change somewhere. That would be great. As of yet though, it has changed absolutely nothing. [2]: Assuming of course that you don't find it significant that the founder of one of the programming communities on the internet is indicting the community's behavior -- although it's not clear if he's referring to the HN community or the broader programming or technical community.
  - jcampbell1 14y ago
    > The entirety of my reply was a tutorial on high school level reading comprehension and a snide remark about HN (well, and a question about you) Maybe before you spend a lot of time complaining about how other people comment, you should start by focusing on making a positive contribution yourself.

jakebellacera 14y ago

jcampbell1 and pg are bringing up a conversation from a another thread: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5110270 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5110270.

thaumaturgy 14y ago
Hmm. pg and jcampbell1's comments predate that thread by several hours, and I don't see the connection anyway. Did you link the wrong thread, or am I missing something?

jcampbell1 14y ago

I was mainly making a joke, but the content of the statement was a problem. Let's consider the relative merits and priorities of "spending time complaining about federal prosecutors" vs. "examining our own community". The former is about trying to change our society to make it more just, the latter is aimless introspection. The comment was a bit of a troll and not insightful so I trolled back. If this were not pg's website, I am certain you wouldn't be defending the statement because it lacks substance.

thaumaturgy 14y ago
> The former is about trying to change our society to make it more just, the latter is aimless introspection. On the contrary, the former is something we probably won't change [1], while the latter is almost certainly something we can change. > The comment was a bit of a troll and not insightful so I trolled back. If this were not pg's website, I am certain you wouldn't be defending the statement because it lacks substance. I seriously doubt he was trolling, and you shouldn't be so certain. This being pg's site is completely irrelevant in this case [2]; I'm simply ... actually, disgusted is about the best adjective I can think of to describe how I feel about the nonsense arguments on HN lately. People seem to be in some kind of a hurry to disagree, because they aren't actually reading and comprehending what other people are writing, they aren't stopping for a moment to consider that perhaps the person they're responding to isn't an idiot or a troll, they aren't maintaining basic principles of civility, they're commenting on (and arguing about!) subjects that are way outside their expertise, and they seem to be nearly drooling at the chance to engage in a witch hunt. For example, nothing in my reply was a defense of pg's statement. Nothing. Not a single word. The entirety of my reply was a tutorial on high school level reading comprehension and a snide remark about HN (well, and a question about you). So, how is it that you interpreted that as a defense of his statement? -- [1]: I may yet be pleasantly surprised. I certainly wouldn't've guessed at how much press the Aaron Swartz case would end up getting, and there is some small chance now that it might end up causing some kind of change somewhere. That would be great. As of yet though, it has changed absolutely nothing. [2]: Assuming of course that you don't find it significant that the founder of one of the programming communities on the internet is indicting the community's behavior -- although it's not clear if he's referring to the HN community or the broader programming or technical community.
- jcampbell1 14y ago
  > The entirety of my reply was a tutorial on high school level reading comprehension and a snide remark about HN (well, and a question about you) Maybe before you spend a lot of time complaining about how other people comment, you should start by focusing on making a positive contribution yourself.