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As a foreigner the one thing that strikes me the most as alienating is that in too many places it's the exact same pattern that is applied. Same roads. Same n

As a foreigner the one thing that strikes me the most as alienating is that in too many places it's the exact same pattern that is applied. Same roads. Same neighborhoods. Same places with restaurants and shops and a big parking in the middle of the square lot. Same toilets. It's alienating because it feels "fake" nearly anywhere you go. Nature, in a lot of places, doesn't have its rights (just look at how some states are "divided" by a straight line: terrifying). Probably one of the worst place for that is Irvine in southern California. Even if it's not "cookie cutter" everywhere, all the neighborhoods still look identical. These decisions may look pragmatic but to many foreigners it feels alienating.

FredFredrickson 14y ago
You know, there's something comforting about going just about anywhere and having, at least, a vague idea of how the layout might be, what things look like, and where to find things. On the other hand though, I agree with you. That same comfort makes it dissatisfying to travel at times. I live in an area of California surrounded by lots of historical smaller cities, but it's nearly pointless to travel to any of them because, aside from a few key features, they all look like the same place overall. Don't even get me started about housing developments. Once you're lost in one of those, your best hope is to start leaving breadcrumbs.
CapitalistCartr 14y ago
It feels alienating to many of us Americans, too. Having visited a few foreign countries, I've seen beautiful public spaces, and its disappointing to come home and see how ugly our cities look now that I've seen better. I desperately want to live in a cosmopolitan urban center that is practical, something I have yet to find here.
- rayiner 14y ago
  Chicago or Philadelphia come pretty close.
akdetrick 14y ago
I wouldn't call it pragmatic, but alienating is definitely the right word. There are few (affordable) places in America right now that you can live without complete car dependence. The poor, elderly, young, and disabled are in fact alienated. It's easy to understand why this pattern of settlement began when you consider the novelty, freedom, individuality (which can not be understated as something Americans valued), and convenience that came with the availability of automobiles. Somehow though, we've moved forward through almost a century of such development, placing the car above all else. I'm reminded of Raquel Nelson, charged with (but thankfully not convicted) manslaughter because a hit an run driver killed her child while she was allegedly jaywalking [1]. [1] http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2011/07/18/woman-convicted-of-homicide-after-drunk-driver-kills-her-child/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2011/07/18/woman-convic... Edit: clarity
- _delirium 14y ago
  Re: the elderly, I think it's also exacerbating the already problematic question of how to care for the increasing number of elderly. There are a lot of elderly who don't really need to be in a nursing home or staffed assisted-living facility, but can't easily live on their own in suburbia because they can't drive. If they were in more urban areas, we might be able to decrease the proportion of the elderly population who need active care, or at least reduce the intensity of care needed. My mom volunteers for Meals on Wheels (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meals_on_Wheels http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meals_on_Wheels), and a lot of the people they deliver to are in decent enough health, but just sort of trapped in suburban apartment complexes. They end up surviving through a mixture of charities like that one, and relatives who drive them around and bring them things. But many end up moving to assisted-living facilities after a bit, even though they don't truly need to live in a staffed facility, because the logistics of living in suburbia without a car are just unworkable, and they either don't know about or can't afford a more walkable area to move to. Also, because Medicare covers nursing homes for people who can't take care of themselves (considered a medical expense) but not the lower-key assisted-living facilities (considered a residential expense, and more likely to be abused), people who run out of money when living in an assisted-living facility may be forced to move prematurely to a nursing home, if they aren't able to go back to living on their own. That ends up both worse for them and more expensive for the public.
rdouble 14y ago
I'm not sure it's the uniformity. Making a neighborhood or city similar to another neighborhood or city has been common throughout history. It's more the vast disconnectedness of everything in the USA that is alienating.
pg 14y ago
It felt alienating to me growing up in it. It still does. In most of America I feel like there's a sort of pressure differential sucking the energy out of me. http://goo.gl/maps/wbd7p http://goo.gl/maps/wbd7p (Strictly speaking I'm a foreigner too, but I came here when I was 3 1/2 so I doubt it's memories of England that make me feel this way.)
Pinckney 14y ago
I'm reminded of the Soviet film "The Irony of Fate" in which the protagonist finds himself in the wrong city by mistake, and fails to realize this due to the uniformity of Soviet architecture. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Irony_of_Fate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Irony_of_Fate
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

FredFredrickson 14y ago

You know, there's something comforting about going just about anywhere and having, at least, a vague idea of how the layout might be, what things look like, and where to find things. On the other hand though, I agree with you. That same comfort makes it dissatisfying to travel at times. I live in an area of California surrounded by lots of historical smaller cities, but it's nearly pointless to travel to any of them because, aside from a few key features, they all look like the same place overall. Don't even get me started about housing developments. Once you're lost in one of those, your best hope is to start leaving breadcrumbs.

CapitalistCartr 14y ago

It feels alienating to many of us Americans, too. Having visited a few foreign countries, I've seen beautiful public spaces, and its disappointing to come home and see how ugly our cities look now that I've seen better. I desperately want to live in a cosmopolitan urban center that is practical, something I have yet to find here.

rayiner 14y ago
Chicago or Philadelphia come pretty close.

akdetrick 14y ago

I wouldn't call it pragmatic, but alienating is definitely the right word. There are few (affordable) places in America right now that you can live without complete car dependence. The poor, elderly, young, and disabled are in fact alienated. It's easy to understand why this pattern of settlement began when you consider the novelty, freedom, individuality (which can not be understated as something Americans valued), and convenience that came with the availability of automobiles. Somehow though, we've moved forward through almost a century of such development, placing the car above all else. I'm reminded of Raquel Nelson, charged with (but thankfully not convicted) manslaughter because a hit an run driver killed her child while she was allegedly jaywalking [1]. [1] http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2011/07/18/woman-convicted-of-homicide-after-drunk-driver-kills-her-child/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2011/07/18/woman-convic... Edit: clarity

_delirium 14y ago
Re: the elderly, I think it's also exacerbating the already problematic question of how to care for the increasing number of elderly. There are a lot of elderly who don't really need to be in a nursing home or staffed assisted-living facility, but can't easily live on their own in suburbia because they can't drive. If they were in more urban areas, we might be able to decrease the proportion of the elderly population who need active care, or at least reduce the intensity of care needed. My mom volunteers for Meals on Wheels (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meals_on_Wheels http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meals_on_Wheels), and a lot of the people they deliver to are in decent enough health, but just sort of trapped in suburban apartment complexes. They end up surviving through a mixture of charities like that one, and relatives who drive them around and bring them things. But many end up moving to assisted-living facilities after a bit, even though they don't truly need to live in a staffed facility, because the logistics of living in suburbia without a car are just unworkable, and they either don't know about or can't afford a more walkable area to move to. Also, because Medicare covers nursing homes for people who can't take care of themselves (considered a medical expense) but not the lower-key assisted-living facilities (considered a residential expense, and more likely to be abused), people who run out of money when living in an assisted-living facility may be forced to move prematurely to a nursing home, if they aren't able to go back to living on their own. That ends up both worse for them and more expensive for the public.

rdouble 14y ago

I'm not sure it's the uniformity. Making a neighborhood or city similar to another neighborhood or city has been common throughout history. It's more the vast disconnectedness of everything in the USA that is alienating.

pg 14y ago

It felt alienating to me growing up in it. It still does. In most of America I feel like there's a sort of pressure differential sucking the energy out of me. http://goo.gl/maps/wbd7p http://goo.gl/maps/wbd7p (Strictly speaking I'm a foreigner too, but I came here when I was 3 1/2 so I doubt it's memories of England that make me feel this way.)

Pinckney 14y ago

I'm reminded of the Soviet film "The Irony of Fate" in which the protagonist finds himself in the wrong city by mistake, and fails to realize this due to the uniformity of Soviet architecture. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Irony_of_Fate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Irony_of_Fate

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]