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DISCLAIMER: This post focuses more on the Goenka courses than Vipassana meditation per se. I'm quite surprised that no dissenting opinion has yet surfaced on t

DISCLAIMER: This post focuses more on the Goenka courses than Vipassana meditation per se. I'm quite surprised that no dissenting opinion has yet surfaced on the topic of Goenka's courses. Most of the commentor's opinions here seem over-enthusiastic, describing the Goenka retreat as 'the best thing in [their] lives'. To me, this is a serious warning sign. I have attended a 10-day retreat, which ended prematurely (on the evening of the 8th day) because of my refusal to watch the evening lectures. While I must agree with the commentors' positive opinions on the meditative experience, I feel compelled to inform any potential attendees that despite claims of 'scientific rationality', the Goenka group is a regular religious sect. When the course begins, the Vipassana technique is presented as an objective tool to achieve insight into the workings of one's own mind and emotions. Mr. Goenka presents himself as someone who merely happened to learn of the technique and is now passing it on. As the days progress, the scarce sleep and food schedule begins to take its toll on the participants' bullshit detectors, and subtle religious notions are slipped into the agenda. These include: * The primacy of Vipassana over other religions * The unreasonableness of other religions * The unquestioned truth of reincarnation * The fact that our bodies are made up of some kind of vibrations I remember finally 'snapping out of it' when Goenka started talking about bubble chambers( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_chamber https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_chamber ) and the depressed scientist who made them. My bullshit detector went on overdrive and I thought about all the things that had been said up to that point during Goenka's video lectures and his taped talks. I realized that I had been subtly manipulated into accepting certain ontological truths, such as the above. These were not things I would have readily accepted coming to the retreat. I also realized I had been planning to continue with Vipassana practice and make it part of my life. Maybe help organize retreats in my home country. Become part of this 'wonderful' movement headed by Mr. Goenka. This was definitely not something I had in mind when I signed up for the course. I know I will not convince anyone who is already engaged with the Goenka group to rethink how they got involved, but I would like to sincerely warn anyone who is considering attending: You will not be alone with your thoughts and emotions during these ten days. You will be accompanied by THE RECORDED VOICE OF GOENKA, for 2-3 hours of each and every day. Every meditation will start with his talks and chants, every meditation will end with his talks and chants. From what I understand, but have obviously not experienced firsthand, the grueling 9-day course ends with a Love-bomb (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_bombing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_bombing). I believe these 'free' courses are set up to lure susceptible people into the organization. Please look into some critical views on any religious group before engaging with one. On the internet, smears abound, but you may also find some grounded critique that may shine light on the structure and purpose of the organization.

bcjordan 14y ago
Having completed a full course, I agree with you regarding the video content. It went beyond practice guidance and veered into disappointing endorsements of woo-woo. The nightly videos start out objective and practice-focused, but by the middle of the course Goenka suggests quantum-scariness explanations for the sensations meditators are feeling. As one retreat participant noted, in one of the nightly video talks [0]: > [Goenka] mixes quantum mechanics with "psychology of enlightenment" What makes it a bit more of a breach of trust is that by the time he breaks out the full-on woo-woo, you're deep in the process—the days are flying by—you purposely don't have your critical thought facilities active. Aside from that sour note, I'd still suggest this course to others. Hitting a stride with practice and tuning your ability to focus your attention on minute sensations is a fascinating experience, especially if you've taken any courses on proprioception, sensation and perception. If you're a rationalist who already firmly rejects the ideas of mind-body separation and reincarnation then you have nothing to worry about. [0]: http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php?topic=1871.0 http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php?topic=1871.0
- ebcase 14y ago
  I've been to a number of 10-day Goenka courses, and agree that in the videos he occasionally drifts off to questionably relevant territory. However, the evening talks also point out that we should mentally "leave aside" any of the intellectual stuff we don't agree with, and instead focus on what our own experience with the technique reveals. The technique itself — actually sitting still and observing breath and sensations — is the important part, not the stuff about bubble chambers, etc.
- particular_ 14y ago
  The arguments made by the poster in your link really resounded with me. It goes against my ethics to recommend these courses to people who are actively seeking to jump-start their meditative practice. As far as being a rationalist goes, I'm not confident that I can always keep my mind free from unwanted social/religious influence, or allow myself to be influenced in a controlled manner. I'm glad that this one off-hand remark about bubble chambers actually awakened me from a cognitive stupor, but I can't be sure that, under slightly different circumstances, I wouldn't have ignored the doubts and the red lights going off somewhere in the back of my head. Cognitive blind spots are a real thing, and my guess is that many Eastern religious groups are very sophisticated in how they use these blind spots to appeal to intelligent, but unsuspecting, individuals. Eastern techniques of religious indoctrination greatly differ from the guilt-based Christian approach that most of us are familiar with. I stand by my position: these retreats are not simply meditation courses. They are a religious ritual held by a well-organized religious group. Moreover, they are deceptively advertised as non-religious, and herein lies my problem with them. If someone wishes to learn meditation from a religious source, I think it is wise to refer to an organization that is overt in its practice and beliefs.

bcjordan 14y ago

Having completed a full course, I agree with you regarding the video content. It went beyond practice guidance and veered into disappointing endorsements of woo-woo. The nightly videos start out objective and practice-focused, but by the middle of the course Goenka suggests quantum-scariness explanations for the sensations meditators are feeling. As one retreat participant noted, in one of the nightly video talks [0]: > [Goenka] mixes quantum mechanics with "psychology of enlightenment" What makes it a bit more of a breach of trust is that by the time he breaks out the full-on woo-woo, you're deep in the process—the days are flying by—you purposely don't have your critical thought facilities active. Aside from that sour note, I'd still suggest this course to others. Hitting a stride with practice and tuning your ability to focus your attention on minute sensations is a fascinating experience, especially if you've taken any courses on proprioception, sensation and perception. If you're a rationalist who already firmly rejects the ideas of mind-body separation and reincarnation then you have nothing to worry about. [0]: http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php?topic=1871.0 http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php?topic=1871.0

ebcase 14y ago
I've been to a number of 10-day Goenka courses, and agree that in the videos he occasionally drifts off to questionably relevant territory. However, the evening talks also point out that we should mentally "leave aside" any of the intellectual stuff we don't agree with, and instead focus on what our own experience with the technique reveals. The technique itself — actually sitting still and observing breath and sensations — is the important part, not the stuff about bubble chambers, etc.
particular_ 14y ago
The arguments made by the poster in your link really resounded with me. It goes against my ethics to recommend these courses to people who are actively seeking to jump-start their meditative practice. As far as being a rationalist goes, I'm not confident that I can always keep my mind free from unwanted social/religious influence, or allow myself to be influenced in a controlled manner. I'm glad that this one off-hand remark about bubble chambers actually awakened me from a cognitive stupor, but I can't be sure that, under slightly different circumstances, I wouldn't have ignored the doubts and the red lights going off somewhere in the back of my head. Cognitive blind spots are a real thing, and my guess is that many Eastern religious groups are very sophisticated in how they use these blind spots to appeal to intelligent, but unsuspecting, individuals. Eastern techniques of religious indoctrination greatly differ from the guilt-based Christian approach that most of us are familiar with. I stand by my position: these retreats are not simply meditation courses. They are a religious ritual held by a well-organized religious group. Moreover, they are deceptively advertised as non-religious, and herein lies my problem with them. If someone wishes to learn meditation from a religious source, I think it is wise to refer to an organization that is overt in its practice and beliefs.