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I found the arxiv server running costs astounding ($800,000/y). Could any one comment on that? Is that typical?

by kghose 14y ago

tangue 14y ago
This is an error. It's the total operating costs. Server costs for 2013 are budgeted for 41,700 $ https://confluence.cornell.edu/download/attachments/127116484/arXiv+Business+Model.pdf https://confluence.cornell.edu/download/attachments/12711648...
- scott_s 14y ago
  I don't think it's an error - and if it is, they still got the right message across. The text says it costs $826,000 to run arXiv's servers. What they meant was to operate arXiv itself, but the main purpose of arXiv is for those servers, so I think it's valid to say "run the servers" as a proxy for all of arXiv itself. That the physical hardware costs $41,700 is not the most important thing. The important figure here is the total operating costs, as that's what keeps the whole show going. This is a good demonstration of the fact that people are generally more expensive than hardware, and paying people to do something as their fulltime job is expensive.
  - walshemj 14y ago
    as a rule of thumb triple the salary to get an idea of the total cost - this is for bog standard jobs. Very technical organizations (Bell Labs JPL, F1 Teams) can have OH rates of 600%+ like the ranked 1 RnD organization I worked at it costs to have those very expensive shops, master level craftsmen and engineers on staff.
  - tangue 14y ago
    You're right. I'm not a native English speaker and like kghose I was a bit surprised by this number (hence my search for the arXiv budget). After reading your comment I see the ambiguity there.
    - scott_s 14y ago
      I was surprised, too, which is why I also read through the budget you linked to.
  - mbell 14y ago
    They spend half their $ on support and admin people. I can't honestly fathom how a site like arXiv could require 3 full time user support people with part time students helping... They have 1.5 FTE listed as devops for arXiv proper, the extra 0.75 in 2013 appears to be dedicated to this: http://invenio-software.org/ http://invenio-software.org/ The actual cost to 'run the servers' appears to be around $200,000 - $250,000. The rest is going into support and I guess a full time person to just 'manage', whatever that means for a project of this type/scope...fund raise I guess? I would think that you'd have volunteer advisers helping with that given the nature of the project.
    - michaelhoffman 14y ago
      You guess? The linked report says 0.5 FTE for "management and administration." I think it's pretty unrealistic to think that managing 7 people alone wouldn't require even a half-time job. Yes, not to mention fundraising, as well as interacting with the advisory board, the volunteer moderators, outreach to users and policymakers. It's also unrealistic to think that running an article management system that has 6000-8000 submissions per month from users all over the world of varying technical ability couldn't occupy three full time user support staff.

I found the arxiv server running costs astounding ($800,000/y). Could any one comment on that? Is that typical?

by kghose 14y ago

I found the arxiv server running costs astounding ($800,000/y). Could any one comment on that? Is that typical?

This is an error. It's the total operating costs. Server costs for 2013 are budgeted for 41,700 $ https://confluence.cornell.edu/download/attachments/127116484/arXiv+Business+Model.pdf https://confluence.cornell.edu/download/attachments/12711648...

scott_s 14y ago
I don't think it's an error - and if it is, they still got the right message across. The text says it costs $826,000 to run arXiv's servers. What they meant was to operate arXiv itself, but the main purpose of arXiv is for those servers, so I think it's valid to say "run the servers" as a proxy for all of arXiv itself. That the physical hardware costs $41,700 is not the most important thing. The important figure here is the total operating costs, as that's what keeps the whole show going. This is a good demonstration of the fact that people are generally more expensive than hardware, and paying people to do something as their fulltime job is expensive.
- walshemj 14y ago
  as a rule of thumb triple the salary to get an idea of the total cost - this is for bog standard jobs. Very technical organizations (Bell Labs JPL, F1 Teams) can have OH rates of 600%+ like the ranked 1 RnD organization I worked at it costs to have those very expensive shops, master level craftsmen and engineers on staff.
- tangue 14y ago
  You're right. I'm not a native English speaker and like kghose I was a bit surprised by this number (hence my search for the arXiv budget). After reading your comment I see the ambiguity there.
  - scott_s 14y ago
    I was surprised, too, which is why I also read through the budget you linked to.
- mbell 14y ago
  They spend half their $ on support and admin people. I can't honestly fathom how a site like arXiv could require 3 full time user support people with part time students helping... They have 1.5 FTE listed as devops for arXiv proper, the extra 0.75 in 2013 appears to be dedicated to this: http://invenio-software.org/ http://invenio-software.org/ The actual cost to 'run the servers' appears to be around $200,000 - $250,000. The rest is going into support and I guess a full time person to just 'manage', whatever that means for a project of this type/scope...fund raise I guess? I would think that you'd have volunteer advisers helping with that given the nature of the project.
  - michaelhoffman 14y ago
    You guess? The linked report says 0.5 FTE for "management and administration." I think it's pretty unrealistic to think that managing 7 people alone wouldn't require even a half-time job. Yes, not to mention fundraising, as well as interacting with the advisory board, the volunteer moderators, outreach to users and policymakers. It's also unrealistic to think that running an article management system that has 6000-8000 submissions per month from users all over the world of varying technical ability couldn't occupy three full time user support staff.