3 ms·

I think you're missing one point. The PC market is open to OS developers and users, there's a well known spec and the user can install any OS he wants, but that

by reidrac 14y ago

I think you're missing one point. The PC market is open to OS developers and users, there's a well known spec and the user can install any OS he wants, but that's not possible (with some minor exceptions, and you may depend on Android) in the mobile market. Until the OS is reasonably independent of the device, I can't see how Ubuntu, FirefoxOS, or Tizen could compete if they can't access to users (even if some, like Mozilla, have deals with phone companies; do I need to buy a specific phone to run their OS?).

gnaffle 14y ago
The only way they can compete in a market such as this is to partner with a manufacturer, and the end result is that they have to play to the manufacturers whim (and often the operators whim if the manufacturer wants to ship devices). The end result is absolutely crap devices loaded with useless "value added" apps and skins. If they could make something revolutionary that people want to have no matter what (like Apple did) then some manufacturers might start selling such devices anyway. But my hopes aren't high for that happening anytime soon.
- shellehs 14y ago
  > The end result is absolutely crap devices loaded with useless "value added" apps and skins. Yes! They have to bend to carrier's will.
shellehs 14y ago
Sorry I do't catch up your opinion very clearly. You can't legally install Mac OS on PC's. You can install Some Linux on, maybe almost PCs but still have some troubles. PCs have restrict hardware standards. But Mobile devices have not explicitly. Users can also install other mobile OS on their mobile devices, for example HTC's HD2, it not only can install Windows mobile/XP/7, Linux, Android, also can install dual-OS. As well as Samsung's Nexus, HTC G1... Firefox OS at first showed us on a Samsung's Galaxy III (?) device. Ubuntu on Galaxy Nexus. They just don't expect to use pre-installed Android devices to run their OS, OS doesn't make money without hardware devices and apps. They have their own markets. Like Firefox, they promise to provide cheap devices, the main market may depend on South America I don't know.
- reidrac 14y ago
  Well, if you can't install Mac OS on a PC is because the software vendor doesn't want you to do so. But get any PC and you can install several OSes without being too picky on the hardware. It's accepted that the hardware and the software are different things. If I want to try FirefoxOS I don't wont to buy a FirefoxOS mobile phone, and it looks like that's going to be the only way.
  - shellehs 14y ago
    Completely, NO. Not the software vendor, it is Apple who does not allow all but Apple's own machines to run Mac OS. It's ilegal but NOT impossible, we see a lot of Hackintosh. So, you can taste Firefox OS now, it is difficulty as installing Mac OS on PCs, maybe more difficulty. If Firefox OS is popular, I believe you can see more and more devices runs Firefox OS who have pre-installed other OS. What they did just promise that theoretically speaking, you can run Firefox OS on any devices running Android, whatever Tizen, Ubuntu, Firefox OS. Linux means run anywhere, any platform, impossible. And anyway, Android based on Linux.
    - reidrac 14y ago
      > Not the software vendor, it is Apple who does not allow all but Apple's own machines to run Mac OS. I'm confused here. I thought Apple is Mac OS' vendor. So, yes... as I said it's because Apple. If the OS vendor wants it to be run on a PC, there's no special requirement. Anyway, that's not the relevant part of my original comment. I can't see how FirefoxOS will be popular if installing it is difficult (even hacky) or if it only works on some specific devices. We need a market were you buy a phone (that comes with an OS), but you're free to install anything else because hardware != software. EDIT: typo
      - shellehs 14y ago
        Install anything easily? Never mind. If you install various OSes on your mobile device, you are not using it, you are playing with it. Users don't mind the OS, users don't pay for operating system, users pay for tools, pay for resolutions. They need highly integrated user experience to complete their tasks, so hardware is very important to software. Who needs a market with free and easy OS installing? Who needs to switch his/her phone's OS? Geeks, or who wants to act like a geek.

by reidrac 14y ago

gnaffle 14y ago

The only way they can compete in a market such as this is to partner with a manufacturer, and the end result is that they have to play to the manufacturers whim (and often the operators whim if the manufacturer wants to ship devices). The end result is absolutely crap devices loaded with useless "value added" apps and skins. If they could make something revolutionary that people want to have no matter what (like Apple did) then some manufacturers might start selling such devices anyway. But my hopes aren't high for that happening anytime soon.

shellehs 14y ago
> The end result is absolutely crap devices loaded with useless "value added" apps and skins. Yes! They have to bend to carrier's will.

shellehs 14y ago

Sorry I do't catch up your opinion very clearly. You can't legally install Mac OS on PC's. You can install Some Linux on, maybe almost PCs but still have some troubles. PCs have restrict hardware standards. But Mobile devices have not explicitly. Users can also install other mobile OS on their mobile devices, for example HTC's HD2, it not only can install Windows mobile/XP/7, Linux, Android, also can install dual-OS. As well as Samsung's Nexus, HTC G1... Firefox OS at first showed us on a Samsung's Galaxy III (?) device. Ubuntu on Galaxy Nexus. They just don't expect to use pre-installed Android devices to run their OS, OS doesn't make money without hardware devices and apps. They have their own markets. Like Firefox, they promise to provide cheap devices, the main market may depend on South America I don't know.

reidrac 14y ago
Well, if you can't install Mac OS on a PC is because the software vendor doesn't want you to do so. But get any PC and you can install several OSes without being too picky on the hardware. It's accepted that the hardware and the software are different things. If I want to try FirefoxOS I don't wont to buy a FirefoxOS mobile phone, and it looks like that's going to be the only way.
- shellehs 14y ago
  Completely, NO. Not the software vendor, it is Apple who does not allow all but Apple's own machines to run Mac OS. It's ilegal but NOT impossible, we see a lot of Hackintosh. So, you can taste Firefox OS now, it is difficulty as installing Mac OS on PCs, maybe more difficulty. If Firefox OS is popular, I believe you can see more and more devices runs Firefox OS who have pre-installed other OS. What they did just promise that theoretically speaking, you can run Firefox OS on any devices running Android, whatever Tizen, Ubuntu, Firefox OS. Linux means run anywhere, any platform, impossible. And anyway, Android based on Linux.
  - reidrac 14y ago
    > Not the software vendor, it is Apple who does not allow all but Apple's own machines to run Mac OS. I'm confused here. I thought Apple is Mac OS' vendor. So, yes... as I said it's because Apple. If the OS vendor wants it to be run on a PC, there's no special requirement. Anyway, that's not the relevant part of my original comment. I can't see how FirefoxOS will be popular if installing it is difficult (even hacky) or if it only works on some specific devices. We need a market were you buy a phone (that comes with an OS), but you're free to install anything else because hardware != software. EDIT: typo
    - shellehs 14y ago
      Install anything easily? Never mind. If you install various OSes on your mobile device, you are not using it, you are playing with it. Users don't mind the OS, users don't pay for operating system, users pay for tools, pay for resolutions. They need highly integrated user experience to complete their tasks, so hardware is very important to software. Who needs a market with free and easy OS installing? Who needs to switch his/her phone's OS? Geeks, or who wants to act like a geek.