4 ms·

Shrug. Being assertive is what it's about. Any long term relationship is going to require maintenance/effort. you're changing yourself to suit her Working o

by temphn 14y ago

Shrug. Being assertive is what it's about. Any long term relationship is going to require maintenance/effort. you're changing yourself to suit her Working out or wearing a suit or getting a good job or listening to a marriage counselor or acting more assertive are all examples of "changing yourself to suit her/women". Working out, for example, is the opposite of "just being yourself". Given that you will be doing this, the key is to spend time on actions that get results. The key premise is that men are attracted to beautiful women just as women are attracted to high-status/confident/alpha men. The first half of that sentence is not controversial to articulate; the last half is where there's a conflict. According to society women should instead want men who are caring, sensitive listeners. Try that yourself and compare that to their response to an assertive leader who gives clear directions. That's all that "alpha" is; it really is an empirically large difference.

antoko 14y ago
That's fine when you're talking in generalities (actually its not its pretty blinkered) but if you're talking about your wife, you're talking about A WOMAN not WOMEN. So you don't need to appeal to the general woman you need to appeal to your specific woman, the best way to do that is to communicate with her. I can't imagine playing some silly guessing game where I try to intuit what she wants. I've been married for 10 years, it seems to me that your advice would apply mostly to people in the first 2 years of a relationship. EDIT - ok so I just read some of the article you linked, I can't really fathom anything about that, I couldn't ever be in a relationship like the ones described so I guess I'm not qualified to comment on how to fix a relationship like that. My relationship is a partnership - not to say that we're equal in every way, we each excel in different areas and support each other as needed. That said, I still don't think that advice is applicable to a lot of people, going from being a doormat to a arrogant alpha seems pretty extreme and likely to undermine the basis of whatever the relationship was founded on (assuming it was founded on something like her being a demanding princess and you being a cringing sycophant)
- coroxout 14y ago
  Yes. I'd like to think that men, especially more introverted guys like the stereotypical hacker, might choose their wives and girlfriends because they liked them as people - real people, with a personality and thoughts and ideas they find interesting. The advice on this blog presupposes that your wife is just something you keep around to cook for you and sleep with you and be some kind of hunting trophy: "look, I bagged me one of these!" You can then keep her sweet with mindgames about how you're too good for her and she should be grateful you come home at all. I hope nobody whose relationship fits in the former category is tempted by these anecdotes into thinking the latter is a better lifestyle choice. Do you really want to treat your supposed loved ones like this?
alanctgardner2 14y ago
> Working out or wearing a suit or getting a good job or listening to a marriage counselor or acting more assertive are all examples of "changing yourself to suit her/women" Wrong. Dead wrong. If you do everything to please your wife, you have a serious personality disorder. I don't mean that in a bad way, I mean it as a statement of something you might not realize. I like dressing up because I like dressing up. I've worn a suit around the house on a lark, I wear ties to a n office where T-shirts are the norm. I absolutely do not do it because I'm trying to please or attract women. On the contrary, it probably seems stuffy and uninviting. I work out because I want to be in good shape, so I can go on cycling trips, and live a longer and healthier life. I don't do it because I want women to stare at my abs (they're coming along, promise). I saw a counselor while I was in a relationship to work through my issues independently. I ended up leaving my girlfriend, who I still love dearly, because I needed space to work through my own pathologies. If I act assertive (and I usually don't), it's because I'm confident that I'm right, and I feel something is urgent. I don't push incorrect opinions on people just for the sake of being manlier than the other person. I try to be considerate of everyone's opinion, and make reasoned decisions. I frequently say 'I don't know', and then go and find out. > According to society women should instead want men who are caring, sensitive listeners The Ryan Gosling school of thought. Unfortunately, as much as you think you're working against society, you've just described a different caricature: James Bond. There are as many bad boys in movies as good ones, and the bad ones usually get the girl. The whole premise of your post is that you live your life and define yourself to optimally please/attract women. If you define yourself only in terms of other people's opinions, you likely suffer for poor self-esteem. As much as the blog you linked is funny, it's not helping you work through your issues. edit: I forgot about > Shrug. You're honestly so afraid of a little introspection that you've resorted to writing out gestures of indifference. Rather than consider your own life and marriage, you're looking for a quick-fix that sounds like a movie ( Grease, specifically, but you're Oliva Newton John).
- hpvic03 14y ago
  Saying that the poster has a serious personality disorder is just over the top. Give it a rest, "game" just means having an interpersonal dynamic that makes conversations and relationships more fun and engaging. It doesn't mean changing who you are, and it doesn't mean that everything you do is for women. If a guy gets in shape and makes himself more fun and interesting to save his marriage, that's a bad thing?
chipsy 14y ago
This is gaslighting language: "This is how it's supposed to be" with no real facts and certainly no declaration of limits. It's okay to cross any boundary in the process of asserting yourself, the way you've put it. In addition, it's quite an insincere sentiment to think of status items only in terms of status. Numerous things can motivate dressing up or getting exercise, and finding the appropriate motivation for them is part of getting a "whole life" instead of just status accumulation. If sincerity is abandoned from the start, the relationship is just business.
illuminate 14y ago
"Shrug. Being assertive is what it's about." Yes, "the man is not assertive enough to match the interest of the woman" is a pretty stupid initial assumption for every marriage on the rocks.

by temphn 14y ago

antoko 14y ago

That's fine when you're talking in generalities (actually its not its pretty blinkered) but if you're talking about your wife, you're talking about A WOMAN not WOMEN. So you don't need to appeal to the general woman you need to appeal to your specific woman, the best way to do that is to communicate with her. I can't imagine playing some silly guessing game where I try to intuit what she wants. I've been married for 10 years, it seems to me that your advice would apply mostly to people in the first 2 years of a relationship. EDIT - ok so I just read some of the article you linked, I can't really fathom anything about that, I couldn't ever be in a relationship like the ones described so I guess I'm not qualified to comment on how to fix a relationship like that. My relationship is a partnership - not to say that we're equal in every way, we each excel in different areas and support each other as needed. That said, I still don't think that advice is applicable to a lot of people, going from being a doormat to a arrogant alpha seems pretty extreme and likely to undermine the basis of whatever the relationship was founded on (assuming it was founded on something like her being a demanding princess and you being a cringing sycophant)

coroxout 14y ago
Yes. I'd like to think that men, especially more introverted guys like the stereotypical hacker, might choose their wives and girlfriends because they liked them as people - real people, with a personality and thoughts and ideas they find interesting. The advice on this blog presupposes that your wife is just something you keep around to cook for you and sleep with you and be some kind of hunting trophy: "look, I bagged me one of these!" You can then keep her sweet with mindgames about how you're too good for her and she should be grateful you come home at all. I hope nobody whose relationship fits in the former category is tempted by these anecdotes into thinking the latter is a better lifestyle choice. Do you really want to treat your supposed loved ones like this?

alanctgardner2 14y ago

> Working out or wearing a suit or getting a good job or listening to a marriage counselor or acting more assertive are all examples of "changing yourself to suit her/women" Wrong. Dead wrong. If you do everything to please your wife, you have a serious personality disorder. I don't mean that in a bad way, I mean it as a statement of something you might not realize. I like dressing up because I like dressing up. I've worn a suit around the house on a lark, I wear ties to a n office where T-shirts are the norm. I absolutely do not do it because I'm trying to please or attract women. On the contrary, it probably seems stuffy and uninviting. I work out because I want to be in good shape, so I can go on cycling trips, and live a longer and healthier life. I don't do it because I want women to stare at my abs (they're coming along, promise). I saw a counselor while I was in a relationship to work through my issues independently. I ended up leaving my girlfriend, who I still love dearly, because I needed space to work through my own pathologies. If I act assertive (and I usually don't), it's because I'm confident that I'm right, and I feel something is urgent. I don't push incorrect opinions on people just for the sake of being manlier than the other person. I try to be considerate of everyone's opinion, and make reasoned decisions. I frequently say 'I don't know', and then go and find out. > According to society women should instead want men who are caring, sensitive listeners The Ryan Gosling school of thought. Unfortunately, as much as you think you're working against society, you've just described a different caricature: James Bond. There are as many bad boys in movies as good ones, and the bad ones usually get the girl. The whole premise of your post is that you live your life and define yourself to optimally please/attract women. If you define yourself only in terms of other people's opinions, you likely suffer for poor self-esteem. As much as the blog you linked is funny, it's not helping you work through your issues. edit: I forgot about > Shrug. You're honestly so afraid of a little introspection that you've resorted to writing out gestures of indifference. Rather than consider your own life and marriage, you're looking for a quick-fix that sounds like a movie ( Grease, specifically, but you're Oliva Newton John).

hpvic03 14y ago
Saying that the poster has a serious personality disorder is just over the top. Give it a rest, "game" just means having an interpersonal dynamic that makes conversations and relationships more fun and engaging. It doesn't mean changing who you are, and it doesn't mean that everything you do is for women. If a guy gets in shape and makes himself more fun and interesting to save his marriage, that's a bad thing?

chipsy 14y ago

This is gaslighting language: "This is how it's supposed to be" with no real facts and certainly no declaration of limits. It's okay to cross any boundary in the process of asserting yourself, the way you've put it. In addition, it's quite an insincere sentiment to think of status items only in terms of status. Numerous things can motivate dressing up or getting exercise, and finding the appropriate motivation for them is part of getting a "whole life" instead of just status accumulation. If sincerity is abandoned from the start, the relationship is just business.

illuminate 14y ago

"Shrug. Being assertive is what it's about." Yes, "the man is not assertive enough to match the interest of the woman" is a pretty stupid initial assumption for every marriage on the rocks.