4 ms·

Who cares if a magazine can be picked up by a metal detector?

el33tel33t 14y ago
Let's see: Everyone who does screening. Everyone who poses a natural target (judges, DAs, federal officers, etc) whose protection depends on screening. Everyone who works in a federal building where they are not allowed to carry guns, and therefore relies on a metal detector to keep gun carrying people out. Everyone who flies. One could go on.
- jlgreco 14y ago
  A magazine that cannot be picked up by a metal detector is useless. It means that the spring, the ammunition, and the rest of the gun are all missing. I mean, if you threw it perhaps it could hurt, but if it's made of plastic probably not so much.
- cdjk 14y ago
  Until someone figures out a way to make plastic bullets (pedantic edit: and cartridges) I'm not going to worry too much about it.
  - travisby 14y ago
    http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=8699 http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=8699 Plastic 308 rounds. Those are real projectiles, not dummy rounds. I do not know if the entire cartridge is plastic, though. That primer definitely looks like metal. And I'm going to assume steel for the cartridge body (wow, it was hard to think of another word than 'brass'). Now, a fully plastic gun is another story...
    - jlgreco 14y ago
      Huh, very interesting. Those would definitely be deadly (considering that even "blanks" can be). I think the cartridge body might be plastic too, if I am reading that page correctly (probably not too odd, that is how shotgun shells are often made I think). Of course those rounds don't have enough recoil to cycle a semi-automatic rifle so I'm not sure how much of an advantage having a high-capacity magazine for those would really give anybody.
    - damoncali 14y ago
      Never head of those before. Very odd. Looks like the whole base is metal, which you would expect, as I'm not sure plastic would be durable/stiff enough for extracting the spent cases reliably. Still trying to figure out what on earth these things are used for. Seems too dangerous to be used off a proper firing range. What good are they?
    - cdjk 14y ago
      I think the cartridge is mostly plastic too, since it says "plastic case cartridge... steel base...." And if it were steel why would they bother painting the cartridge blue? The primer is definitely steel, however. In any event, the barrel at least has to be metal, so this seems similar to the risk of someone bringing gunpowder into a secure area.
      - runarb 14y ago
        "And if it were steel why would they bother painting the cartridge blue" Do distinguished them from other rounds. When I was in the Norwegian military we had at list bullets painted: Red: Blanks. Blu: Plastic bullets for training. Cheap and less pollution then lead. Yellow: Tracer rounds.
    - runarb 14y ago
      Thus are military training rounds. The bullet are plastic, but the cartridge is brass. They are generally not deadly, and are sometimes used to fire at people with (as a form of paintball, but that is ill advised). They are meant for training with outdoors. They are cheaper then normal bullets, less pollution then lead and don't goes so fare (a normal 7.62mm bullets can be deadly for upwards to 3.5 kilometers, making random shouting in a simulated setting outside unsafe). More info about this bullets are available at http://gunlore.awardspace.info/rifledarms/ammunition/dag762by51.htm http://gunlore.awardspace.info/rifledarms/ammunition/dag762b... However caseless ammunition also exist: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caseless_ammunition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caseless_ammunition . Thus could probably be made without any metal.
      - rdl 14y ago
        The IDF uses rubber bullets extensively as a non-lethal form of ammunition. I think during the Nth intifada there was a story about plastic bullets being used, with them being actually worse than metal since they wouldn't show up on x-ray, although they would shed energy and momentum really fast compared to metal. http://www.nytimes.com/1988/09/29/world/us-protesting-israelis-use-of-plastic-bullets.html http://www.nytimes.com/1988/09/29/world/us-protesting-israel... http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/29/world/israeli-army-lawyer-defends-use-of-plastic-bullets.html http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/29/world/israeli-army-lawyer-...
  - dhughes 14y ago
    Bullets are not the only thing which can kill even a compressed air canister which expels some sort of projectile can be lethal.
    - jlgreco 14y ago
      That really has nothing to do with plastic magazines anymore does it? I'm sure they don't allow spear guns, slingshots, and potato cannons (not metallic!) in court houses already.
    - Zimahl 14y ago
      A lot of people don't realize that Lewis and Clark used an air rifle. There's a great little movie about it on Youtube[1]. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pqFyKh-rUI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pqFyKh-rUI
- defilade 14y ago
  Newsflash: magazines aren't restricted items because they're useless without guns. Which are made of metal. Newsflash #2: we've had plastic magazines for years already.
- eridius 14y ago
  You're conflating magazines and guns. A magazine can't fire bullets. It can't hurt people. So who the hell cares if they get picked up on metal detectors? You want to catch the gun, not the magazine.
- InclinedPlane 14y ago
  Things that can be picked up by metal detectors easily: bullets, ammunition casings, gun barrels, gun slides, recoil springs, magazine springs. Polymer cased ammunition exists but is very rare and not general purpose (e.g. flechette rounds), but even those rounds would show up quite easily on a magnetometer based metal detector due to the steel content in the flechettes. The idea of a "plastic gun" is a myth that has been advanced due to the extreme ignorance of the media inducing a moral panic in the 1980s after the introduction of the Glock 17, which merely had a plastic frame and still contained over a pound of metal in it.

Let's see: Everyone who does screening. Everyone who poses a natural target (judges, DAs, federal officers, etc) whose protection depends on screening. Everyone who works in a federal building where they are not allowed to carry guns, and therefore relies on a metal detector to keep gun carrying people out. Everyone who flies. One could go on.

jlgreco 14y ago
A magazine that cannot be picked up by a metal detector is useless. It means that the spring, the ammunition, and the rest of the gun are all missing. I mean, if you threw it perhaps it could hurt, but if it's made of plastic probably not so much.
cdjk 14y ago
Until someone figures out a way to make plastic bullets (pedantic edit: and cartridges) I'm not going to worry too much about it.
- travisby 14y ago
  http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=8699 http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=8699 Plastic 308 rounds. Those are real projectiles, not dummy rounds. I do not know if the entire cartridge is plastic, though. That primer definitely looks like metal. And I'm going to assume steel for the cartridge body (wow, it was hard to think of another word than 'brass'). Now, a fully plastic gun is another story...
  - jlgreco 14y ago
    Huh, very interesting. Those would definitely be deadly (considering that even "blanks" can be). I think the cartridge body might be plastic too, if I am reading that page correctly (probably not too odd, that is how shotgun shells are often made I think). Of course those rounds don't have enough recoil to cycle a semi-automatic rifle so I'm not sure how much of an advantage having a high-capacity magazine for those would really give anybody.
  - damoncali 14y ago
    Never head of those before. Very odd. Looks like the whole base is metal, which you would expect, as I'm not sure plastic would be durable/stiff enough for extracting the spent cases reliably. Still trying to figure out what on earth these things are used for. Seems too dangerous to be used off a proper firing range. What good are they?
  - cdjk 14y ago
    I think the cartridge is mostly plastic too, since it says "plastic case cartridge... steel base...." And if it were steel why would they bother painting the cartridge blue? The primer is definitely steel, however. In any event, the barrel at least has to be metal, so this seems similar to the risk of someone bringing gunpowder into a secure area.
    - runarb 14y ago
      "And if it were steel why would they bother painting the cartridge blue" Do distinguished them from other rounds. When I was in the Norwegian military we had at list bullets painted: Red: Blanks. Blu: Plastic bullets for training. Cheap and less pollution then lead. Yellow: Tracer rounds.
  - runarb 14y ago
    Thus are military training rounds. The bullet are plastic, but the cartridge is brass. They are generally not deadly, and are sometimes used to fire at people with (as a form of paintball, but that is ill advised). They are meant for training with outdoors. They are cheaper then normal bullets, less pollution then lead and don't goes so fare (a normal 7.62mm bullets can be deadly for upwards to 3.5 kilometers, making random shouting in a simulated setting outside unsafe). More info about this bullets are available at http://gunlore.awardspace.info/rifledarms/ammunition/dag762by51.htm http://gunlore.awardspace.info/rifledarms/ammunition/dag762b... However caseless ammunition also exist: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caseless_ammunition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caseless_ammunition . Thus could probably be made without any metal.
    - rdl 14y ago
      The IDF uses rubber bullets extensively as a non-lethal form of ammunition. I think during the Nth intifada there was a story about plastic bullets being used, with them being actually worse than metal since they wouldn't show up on x-ray, although they would shed energy and momentum really fast compared to metal. http://www.nytimes.com/1988/09/29/world/us-protesting-israelis-use-of-plastic-bullets.html http://www.nytimes.com/1988/09/29/world/us-protesting-israel... http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/29/world/israeli-army-lawyer-defends-use-of-plastic-bullets.html http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/29/world/israeli-army-lawyer-...
- dhughes 14y ago
  Bullets are not the only thing which can kill even a compressed air canister which expels some sort of projectile can be lethal.
  - jlgreco 14y ago
    That really has nothing to do with plastic magazines anymore does it? I'm sure they don't allow spear guns, slingshots, and potato cannons (not metallic!) in court houses already.
  - Zimahl 14y ago
    A lot of people don't realize that Lewis and Clark used an air rifle. There's a great little movie about it on Youtube[1]. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pqFyKh-rUI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pqFyKh-rUI
defilade 14y ago
Newsflash: magazines aren't restricted items because they're useless without guns. Which are made of metal. Newsflash #2: we've had plastic magazines for years already.
eridius 14y ago
You're conflating magazines and guns. A magazine can't fire bullets. It can't hurt people. So who the hell cares if they get picked up on metal detectors? You want to catch the gun, not the magazine.
InclinedPlane 14y ago
Things that can be picked up by metal detectors easily: bullets, ammunition casings, gun barrels, gun slides, recoil springs, magazine springs. Polymer cased ammunition exists but is very rare and not general purpose (e.g. flechette rounds), but even those rounds would show up quite easily on a magnetometer based metal detector due to the steel content in the flechettes. The idea of a "plastic gun" is a myth that has been advanced due to the extreme ignorance of the media inducing a moral panic in the 1980s after the introduction of the Glock 17, which merely had a plastic frame and still contained over a pound of metal in it.