6 ms·

Show HN: Super Debugger, a realtime messaging iOS Debugger tool

75 points by jbrennan 14y ago

jbrennan 14y ago
Builds on F-Script to give a Smalltalk-like syntax to iOS apps. You can read a bit more about it here: http://www.shopify.com/technology/7183290-introducing-the-super-debugger-a-wireless-real-time-debugger-for-ios-apps#axzz2I9qFiFse http://www.shopify.com/technology/7183290-introducing-the-su...
scrumper 14y ago
Very interesting! I just started building a CLI for one of my apps to aid in debugging; this means I can scrap that dead-end work. Forked, will check it out.
- jbrennan 14y ago
  And feel free to contribute changes back. So far there's the shell, but I think many different tools could be built on this. I'd love to see someone do a column browser for objects.
- googletron 14y ago
  Why would you scrap your work?
  - scrumper 14y ago
    Fair question. Superdb does what I want: interactive state examination without breakpoints. I hadn't got very far with mine at all, and it was intimately bound up with the design of my app so wouldn't have been reusable even in my own future projects. Then there is the chance that I'll be able to contribute to superdb, something which appeals to my sense of community far more than writing some for-my-eyes-only, debug code for a closed-source app. Mainly, though, I hate reinventing wheels. I'm not a very good programmer and it would take me far too long. I'll always look for a friendly giant to stand on before I try and build my own ladder.
khangtoh 14y ago
superdbg is a more fitting name, anyone searching for a super database that's cloud-based, auto-scales, handles web-scale type load for their next generation social network might stumble upon superdb and be utterly disappointed.
jpsim 14y ago
Well I'm adding this to my current PonyDebugger, Charles Proxy & OHHTTPStubs debugging stack. Great job!
- seivan 14y ago
  Using the same stack :)
gfodor 14y ago
This is cool. I have been building an app in RubyMotion and the REPL has been pretty useful. That said, at least for me, the REPL is a bit overhyped. In most cases the stuff you will tweak with the REPL is UI stuff. But the thing is if you are using IB and designing your screens in Photoshop or Sketch, the UI should be pretty much in place before it hits the code. As far as other use-cases beyond UI, if you are doing any other type of "testing" in the REPL, you probably should be writing unit tests :)
- niggler 14y ago
  > if you are using IB For anything nontrivial, IB is more of a hindrance than an aid. You probably are constructing the view programmatically.
  - gfodor 14y ago
    "Trivial" views are the rule though. And with autolayout, IB is much more important since it's the only way to effectively test the behavior of your constraints interactively. (By setting the screen size to "free form" and dragging the control handle, like a web browser window.)
  - myko 14y ago
    What are some nontrivial examples? I've only been an iOS developer as my day job for about a year now, and I don't know everything - but rarely do I need to resort to code to do my interfaces. That said, merging xib's is a pain in the ass. I wish they were more like Android's human readable layouts.
  - interpol_p 14y ago
    I disagree with the blanket statement that for anything non-trivial, IB is more of a hindrance. I've worked on a number of large iOS projects over the last four years — I tend to select whether or not to use IB on a per-project basis. About 60% of our projects end up using IB for the majority of their UI layout. Recently we built a very large educational app for teachers. IB was great — we had a number of key storyboards, most of the design happened very fast. We developed strict standards by which we developed further styling in code (for things that IB couldn't handle like pattern images, and stretchable images). Merging Storyboards was a bit of a pain — which was exacerbated by the fact that it's much easier for multiple developers to touch a single storyboard than to touch a single xib. But using DiffMerge as our default git mergetool makes things better. There are definitely times when IB is not suitable — especially if you want to develop reusable dynamic layouts or controls. But when you have strict specs, designers working on the project in advance, and clients signing off on particular designs, IB is great.
grinich 14y ago
I love when people put a bit of personality into their project pages. Those first 4 frames are delightfully fun. Nice Nintendo throwback.
- jbrennan 14y ago
  I was wondering how long it would take someone to recognize that. Glad you like it! I put a lot of work into the project page.
- misnome 14y ago
  "Personality" is one thing, but this is just awful. I'm a developer, looking at the page to find out about a potentially useful tool. I'm not a graphic design student looking for inspiration; I value succinct, direct information, preferably with short examples that I don't have to go hunting (or scrolling miles) for. (Are there any real developers who seriously prefer a video?) After the first couple of screens of scrolling with no more than a couple of scattered words, I gave up. The information density is so low that I've forgotten what the last screen says before I've read the next one.
  - carson_ 14y ago
    Sooo what you're looking for is the Github readme, available from the button at the top of the wiki page. Wikis are for first looks, readmes are for the skin-and-bones usage guidelines. https://github.com/Shopify/superdb https://github.com/Shopify/superdb
    - pdenya 14y ago
      I wish the link went straight to this github page. In my experience wikis haven't been worth opening to get an overview of the product. Thanks for the link though.
mpweiher 14y ago
Here's a possibly more comprehensive take on the same idea, illustrated by creating a badge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RkvUX_4Ros http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RkvUX_4Ros It demonstrates the creation of a graphical element in a live coding environment. The finished badge is then transferred to an iOS app and tweaked interactively. One thing that isn't shown is that the code is simultaneously saved to a file within the Xcode project, so live tweaks and XCode project stay in sync.
- jbrennan 14y ago
  Although I haven't attempted it, I'm guessing that example would also be possible with Super Debugger. It would require a different interface, but I think it's possible. >One thing that isn't shown is that the code is simultaneously saved to a file within the Xcode project, so live tweaks and XCode project stay in sync. That's one thing I've yet to solve for superdb but would really love to get figured out. If you (or anyone) has any suggestions on how to implement it, let me know.
drudru11 14y ago
wow - where are these developers getting the designers to do these landing pages?
- jbrennan 14y ago
  I'm the developer and I did the design myself! (I'm not much of a designer, but I try to stick to the essentials. Typography, contrast, and direction)
anotherbadlogin 14y ago
What is the point of linking to that page that doesn't do anything, and making you click AGAIN on the GitHub button? And then you don't go to a description or anything, just the home page of the GitHub project.

75 points by jbrennan 14y ago

Builds on F-Script to give a Smalltalk-like syntax to iOS apps. You can read a bit more about it here: http://www.shopify.com/technology/7183290-introducing-the-super-debugger-a-wireless-real-time-debugger-for-ios-apps#axzz2I9qFiFse http://www.shopify.com/technology/7183290-introducing-the-su...

scrumper 14y ago

Very interesting! I just started building a CLI for one of my apps to aid in debugging; this means I can scrap that dead-end work. Forked, will check it out.

jbrennan 14y ago
And feel free to contribute changes back. So far there's the shell, but I think many different tools could be built on this. I'd love to see someone do a column browser for objects.
googletron 14y ago
Why would you scrap your work?
- scrumper 14y ago
  Fair question. Superdb does what I want: interactive state examination without breakpoints. I hadn't got very far with mine at all, and it was intimately bound up with the design of my app so wouldn't have been reusable even in my own future projects. Then there is the chance that I'll be able to contribute to superdb, something which appeals to my sense of community far more than writing some for-my-eyes-only, debug code for a closed-source app. Mainly, though, I hate reinventing wheels. I'm not a very good programmer and it would take me far too long. I'll always look for a friendly giant to stand on before I try and build my own ladder.

khangtoh 14y ago

superdbg is a more fitting name, anyone searching for a super database that's cloud-based, auto-scales, handles web-scale type load for their next generation social network might stumble upon superdb and be utterly disappointed.

jpsim 14y ago

Well I'm adding this to my current PonyDebugger, Charles Proxy & OHHTTPStubs debugging stack. Great job!

seivan 14y ago
Using the same stack :)

gfodor 14y ago

This is cool. I have been building an app in RubyMotion and the REPL has been pretty useful. That said, at least for me, the REPL is a bit overhyped. In most cases the stuff you will tweak with the REPL is UI stuff. But the thing is if you are using IB and designing your screens in Photoshop or Sketch, the UI should be pretty much in place before it hits the code. As far as other use-cases beyond UI, if you are doing any other type of "testing" in the REPL, you probably should be writing unit tests :)

niggler 14y ago
> if you are using IB For anything nontrivial, IB is more of a hindrance than an aid. You probably are constructing the view programmatically.
- gfodor 14y ago
  "Trivial" views are the rule though. And with autolayout, IB is much more important since it's the only way to effectively test the behavior of your constraints interactively. (By setting the screen size to "free form" and dragging the control handle, like a web browser window.)
- myko 14y ago
  What are some nontrivial examples? I've only been an iOS developer as my day job for about a year now, and I don't know everything - but rarely do I need to resort to code to do my interfaces. That said, merging xib's is a pain in the ass. I wish they were more like Android's human readable layouts.
- interpol_p 14y ago
  I disagree with the blanket statement that for anything non-trivial, IB is more of a hindrance. I've worked on a number of large iOS projects over the last four years — I tend to select whether or not to use IB on a per-project basis. About 60% of our projects end up using IB for the majority of their UI layout. Recently we built a very large educational app for teachers. IB was great — we had a number of key storyboards, most of the design happened very fast. We developed strict standards by which we developed further styling in code (for things that IB couldn't handle like pattern images, and stretchable images). Merging Storyboards was a bit of a pain — which was exacerbated by the fact that it's much easier for multiple developers to touch a single storyboard than to touch a single xib. But using DiffMerge as our default git mergetool makes things better. There are definitely times when IB is not suitable — especially if you want to develop reusable dynamic layouts or controls. But when you have strict specs, designers working on the project in advance, and clients signing off on particular designs, IB is great.

grinich 14y ago

I love when people put a bit of personality into their project pages. Those first 4 frames are delightfully fun. Nice Nintendo throwback.

jbrennan 14y ago
I was wondering how long it would take someone to recognize that. Glad you like it! I put a lot of work into the project page.
misnome 14y ago
"Personality" is one thing, but this is just awful. I'm a developer, looking at the page to find out about a potentially useful tool. I'm not a graphic design student looking for inspiration; I value succinct, direct information, preferably with short examples that I don't have to go hunting (or scrolling miles) for. (Are there any real developers who seriously prefer a video?) After the first couple of screens of scrolling with no more than a couple of scattered words, I gave up. The information density is so low that I've forgotten what the last screen says before I've read the next one.
- carson_ 14y ago
  Sooo what you're looking for is the Github readme, available from the button at the top of the wiki page. Wikis are for first looks, readmes are for the skin-and-bones usage guidelines. https://github.com/Shopify/superdb https://github.com/Shopify/superdb
  - pdenya 14y ago
    I wish the link went straight to this github page. In my experience wikis haven't been worth opening to get an overview of the product. Thanks for the link though.

mpweiher 14y ago

Here's a possibly more comprehensive take on the same idea, illustrated by creating a badge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RkvUX_4Ros http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RkvUX_4Ros It demonstrates the creation of a graphical element in a live coding environment. The finished badge is then transferred to an iOS app and tweaked interactively. One thing that isn't shown is that the code is simultaneously saved to a file within the Xcode project, so live tweaks and XCode project stay in sync.

jbrennan 14y ago
Although I haven't attempted it, I'm guessing that example would also be possible with Super Debugger. It would require a different interface, but I think it's possible. >One thing that isn't shown is that the code is simultaneously saved to a file within the Xcode project, so live tweaks and XCode project stay in sync. That's one thing I've yet to solve for superdb but would really love to get figured out. If you (or anyone) has any suggestions on how to implement it, let me know.

drudru11 14y ago

wow - where are these developers getting the designers to do these landing pages?

jbrennan 14y ago
I'm the developer and I did the design myself! (I'm not much of a designer, but I try to stick to the essentials. Typography, contrast, and direction)

anotherbadlogin 14y ago

What is the point of linking to that page that doesn't do anything, and making you click AGAIN on the GitHub button? And then you don't go to a description or anything, just the home page of the GitHub project.