5 ms·

>Knoll asked me, "You probably only noticed the odd lighting in the interior scenes, not in the outdoors scenes, right?" And once he asked it this way, I realiz

by ginko 14y ago

>Knoll asked me, "You probably only noticed the odd lighting in the interior scenes, not in the outdoors scenes, right?" And once he asked it this way, I realize he was right. The scenes in the HFR version that seemed odd were all inside. The landscape scenes were stunning in a good way. "That's because they didn't have to light the outside; the real lighting is all that was needed, so nothing seemed amiss." I would love to see cinematographers experiment with natural lighting for shots. Kubrick (in)famously did this in Barry Lyndon[1] 37 years ago. To do this he used f/0.7 Carl Zeiss lenses that were designed for NASA. Nowadays we are far less limited due to the incredible light-sensitivity of modern image sensors. And if that doesn't work we can go for larger sensors, which would still be far cheaper than doing the same with film. I have a feeling Kubrick would be having a field day with current tech and would have been one of the first supporters of 48Hz. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography

mcphilip 14y ago
>Starting with The New World, Malick has instituted “rules” in his filmmaking, including using only natural light, no cranes, no big rigs, and handheld cameras only [1]. You might want to checkout New World if natural lighting interests you. Malick is known as the "director's director" and has done a lot of very interesting work. He loves trying to capture "unrepeatable moments", like how he used a clip of an in-costume Christian Bale taking a break smoking a corn cob pipe in New World when Bale didn't even realize he was on camera. [1]http://stillsearching.wordpress.com/2011/05/21/39-facts-about-terrence-malick/ http://stillsearching.wordpress.com/2011/05/21/39-facts-abou...
- shashashasha 14y ago
  There's also the films of the Dogme 95 group (ie, Lars von Trier) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 Notable rules for them being avoiding music that doesn't exist in the environment, shooting only handheld, only the barest of lighting.
  - wahnfrieden 14y ago
    I've seen many poor Dogme95 films, but I can heartily recommend Thomas Vinterberg's Festen as both a prime example of the experiment (he was one of the co-institutors of Dogme) and a great film on its own merits.
- hyperbovine 14y ago
  Do you have a source for the story about the corn cob pipe? I'd love to see that scene, but can't seem to find any mention of it online.
  - mcphilip 14y ago
    As I recall it was discussed in the DVD extras on The New World. I remember that scene in the movie, but it's been years since I've watched it.
- jeremyswank 14y ago
  "Don’t allow yourself to fall in love with the camera. Keep it in its place and keep your eye open for those little moments you didn’t plan for. It’s my definition of what it is to be a movie director: A man who presides over accidents." -Orson Welles
  - Hari_Seldon 14y ago
    Great quote, haven't heard this before, thanks.
  - cpeterso 14y ago
    Similarly, Werner Herzog said: "Coincidences always happen if you keep your mind open, while storyboards remain the instruments of cowards who do not trust in their own imagination and who are slaves of a matrix... If you get used to planning your shots based solely on aesthetics, you are never that far from kitsch."
enneff 14y ago
> I would love to see cinematographers experiment with natural lighting for shots. What are you talking about? Many films are made with natural light. Kubrick wasn't alone.
- zalew 14y ago
  indoors.
  - wahnfrieden 14y ago
    Yes. Some Dogme95 films. Pedro Costa's Colossal Youth. Amadeus. I'm sure I'm missing many others...
    - zalew 14y ago
      I believe there are some, but it's still unusual.
- krg 14y ago
  I think it is interior shots filmed using only candlelight, as described here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography This was/is unusual.
anigbrowl 14y ago
Kubrick would have loved the high sensitivity of current senros, which makes it practical to shoot without artificial light* though it has to be said that film stocks have improved a great deal since Barry Lyndon was shot. But I'm much less certain about whether he would have embraced 48 FPS (not Hz, because we're not modulating a coherent beam). He had such technology fully available to him as far back as the 60s and chose not to employ it. * Lighting is not just about making sure there's enough light. Some scenes look great just as they are. Most...don't. Your brain filters out a lot of what you don't care about it in the real world, but when you see it on screen it sticks out like a sore thumb. Lighting is more of an artistic than a functional thing in most cases, and is used to draw the viewer's attention towards or away from what the director wishes.
- 13hours 14y ago
  The unit Hz is used for frequency, per definition "per second". If "frames" are implied, surely 48Hz is acceptable?
  - anigbrowl 14y ago
    It doesn't bother me, but it's not the standard nomenclature in the film industry.
jonah 14y ago
Here's a great piece on that lens[1]. Also, it's on view at LACMA through June 30[2]. [1] http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/sk/ac/len/page1.htm http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/sk/ac/len/page1.htm [2] http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/stanley-kubrick http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/stanley-kubrick
bbx 14y ago
This reminds me of the Dogme 95 movement from Danish directors[1]. It's a set of 10 filmmaking rules among which is: > The film must be in colour. Special lighting is not acceptable (if there is too little light for exposure the scene must be cut or a single lamp be attached to the camera). [1] : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
ars 14y ago
> Kubrick (in)famously did this in Barry Lyndon[1] 37 years ago. To do this he used f/0.7 Carl Zeiss lenses And about 250 candles (not exaggerating). There is nothing "natural" about that. Normal humans use maybe 10 candles in a room that size, the camera needed way more. I never understood what made candles so much better than electric lights with a color filter for that scene. The number of candles made it completely unnatural.

by ginko 14y ago

mcphilip 14y ago

>Starting with The New World, Malick has instituted “rules” in his filmmaking, including using only natural light, no cranes, no big rigs, and handheld cameras only [1]. You might want to checkout New World if natural lighting interests you. Malick is known as the "director's director" and has done a lot of very interesting work. He loves trying to capture "unrepeatable moments", like how he used a clip of an in-costume Christian Bale taking a break smoking a corn cob pipe in New World when Bale didn't even realize he was on camera. [1]http://stillsearching.wordpress.com/2011/05/21/39-facts-about-terrence-malick/ http://stillsearching.wordpress.com/2011/05/21/39-facts-abou...

shashashasha 14y ago
There's also the films of the Dogme 95 group (ie, Lars von Trier) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 Notable rules for them being avoiding music that doesn't exist in the environment, shooting only handheld, only the barest of lighting.
- wahnfrieden 14y ago
  I've seen many poor Dogme95 films, but I can heartily recommend Thomas Vinterberg's Festen as both a prime example of the experiment (he was one of the co-institutors of Dogme) and a great film on its own merits.
hyperbovine 14y ago
Do you have a source for the story about the corn cob pipe? I'd love to see that scene, but can't seem to find any mention of it online.
- mcphilip 14y ago
  As I recall it was discussed in the DVD extras on The New World. I remember that scene in the movie, but it's been years since I've watched it.
jeremyswank 14y ago
"Don’t allow yourself to fall in love with the camera. Keep it in its place and keep your eye open for those little moments you didn’t plan for. It’s my definition of what it is to be a movie director: A man who presides over accidents." -Orson Welles
- Hari_Seldon 14y ago
  Great quote, haven't heard this before, thanks.
- cpeterso 14y ago
  Similarly, Werner Herzog said: "Coincidences always happen if you keep your mind open, while storyboards remain the instruments of cowards who do not trust in their own imagination and who are slaves of a matrix... If you get used to planning your shots based solely on aesthetics, you are never that far from kitsch."

enneff 14y ago

> I would love to see cinematographers experiment with natural lighting for shots. What are you talking about? Many films are made with natural light. Kubrick wasn't alone.

zalew 14y ago
indoors.
- wahnfrieden 14y ago
  Yes. Some Dogme95 films. Pedro Costa's Colossal Youth. Amadeus. I'm sure I'm missing many others...
  - zalew 14y ago
    I believe there are some, but it's still unusual.
krg 14y ago
I think it is interior shots filmed using only candlelight, as described here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Lyndon#Cinematography This was/is unusual.

anigbrowl 14y ago

Kubrick would have loved the high sensitivity of current senros, which makes it practical to shoot without artificial light* though it has to be said that film stocks have improved a great deal since Barry Lyndon was shot. But I'm much less certain about whether he would have embraced 48 FPS (not Hz, because we're not modulating a coherent beam). He had such technology fully available to him as far back as the 60s and chose not to employ it. * Lighting is not just about making sure there's enough light. Some scenes look great just as they are. Most...don't. Your brain filters out a lot of what you don't care about it in the real world, but when you see it on screen it sticks out like a sore thumb. Lighting is more of an artistic than a functional thing in most cases, and is used to draw the viewer's attention towards or away from what the director wishes.

13hours 14y ago
The unit Hz is used for frequency, per definition "per second". If "frames" are implied, surely 48Hz is acceptable?
- anigbrowl 14y ago
  It doesn't bother me, but it's not the standard nomenclature in the film industry.

jonah 14y ago

Here's a great piece on that lens[1]. Also, it's on view at LACMA through June 30[2]. [1] http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/sk/ac/len/page1.htm http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/sk/ac/len/page1.htm [2] http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/stanley-kubrick http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/stanley-kubrick

bbx 14y ago

This reminds me of the Dogme 95 movement from Danish directors[1]. It's a set of 10 filmmaking rules among which is: > The film must be in colour. Special lighting is not acceptable (if there is too little light for exposure the scene must be cut or a single lamp be attached to the camera). [1] : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

ars 14y ago

> Kubrick (in)famously did this in Barry Lyndon[1] 37 years ago. To do this he used f/0.7 Carl Zeiss lenses And about 250 candles (not exaggerating). There is nothing "natural" about that. Normal humans use maybe 10 candles in a room that size, the camera needed way more. I never understood what made candles so much better than electric lights with a color filter for that scene. The number of candles made it completely unnatural.