3 ms·

I feel as though we ought to hold our comments to higher standards than "expresses a strong negative opinion with no supporting evidence or reasoning". Maybe th

I feel as though we ought to hold our comments to higher standards than "expresses a strong negative opinion with no supporting evidence or reasoning". Maybe that's just me? It certainly feels strange that this sort of comment is being defended when the same comment with PHP replaced by Python/Ruby/(Java/Coffee)script/Haskell/C/C++ would be universally reviled.

PommeDeTerre 14y ago
I don't think that the supporting evidence needs to be explicitly stated. Those of us who have used PHP before inherently know why he posted what he posted. The evidence and reasoning is in our past experience with the language, and it's much stronger than a "citation" of some blog post or anything of that sort. It's quite telling that we don't see comments like that for other languages that often, if ever. Aside from perhaps JavaScript, no other mainstream programming language causes experienced programmers so much grief. No other language is so riddled with obvious deficiencies, and so problematic.
- shaldengeki 14y ago
  I hardly think that you and he speak for "those of us who have used PHP before", and to pretend that you do seems awfully arrogant on your part. I definitely don't share your sentiments, that's for sure! Even if you did speak for everyone who'd used PHP before, I don't think this comment is in any way useful or productive - are we all just supposed to take it on faith that every person who has a strong negative opinion on something speaks for everyone who's familiar with the topic? It seems to me that this is precisely against the spirit of HN (and reasoned discussion in general). So yes, I think that if you're going to make a comment like "PHP needs to die" and want to contribute something meaningful to the discussion, you're expected to elaborate on why you think that way. It's surprising to me that you're even trying to say otherwise. I'm not sure what to make of your assertion that the existence of a vocal group of PHP haters indicates that "PHP needs to die". I'll admit the language has its warts, but the hatred directed at PHP on HN seems way out of proportion to any other programming community I've been to, and out of proportion to the actual deficiencies with the language. And I don't really think that it makes sense to call PHP a "cancer" or to say that the existence of PHP is a problem; it's not as if we shun and shame programmers when they try to migrate from PHP to other languages, and it's not as if PHP paradigms are "infiltrating" other languages.

PommeDeTerre 14y ago

I don't think that the supporting evidence needs to be explicitly stated. Those of us who have used PHP before inherently know why he posted what he posted. The evidence and reasoning is in our past experience with the language, and it's much stronger than a "citation" of some blog post or anything of that sort. It's quite telling that we don't see comments like that for other languages that often, if ever. Aside from perhaps JavaScript, no other mainstream programming language causes experienced programmers so much grief. No other language is so riddled with obvious deficiencies, and so problematic.

shaldengeki 14y ago
I hardly think that you and he speak for "those of us who have used PHP before", and to pretend that you do seems awfully arrogant on your part. I definitely don't share your sentiments, that's for sure! Even if you did speak for everyone who'd used PHP before, I don't think this comment is in any way useful or productive - are we all just supposed to take it on faith that every person who has a strong negative opinion on something speaks for everyone who's familiar with the topic? It seems to me that this is precisely against the spirit of HN (and reasoned discussion in general). So yes, I think that if you're going to make a comment like "PHP needs to die" and want to contribute something meaningful to the discussion, you're expected to elaborate on why you think that way. It's surprising to me that you're even trying to say otherwise. I'm not sure what to make of your assertion that the existence of a vocal group of PHP haters indicates that "PHP needs to die". I'll admit the language has its warts, but the hatred directed at PHP on HN seems way out of proportion to any other programming community I've been to, and out of proportion to the actual deficiencies with the language. And I don't really think that it makes sense to call PHP a "cancer" or to say that the existence of PHP is a problem; it's not as if we shun and shame programmers when they try to migrate from PHP to other languages, and it's not as if PHP paradigms are "infiltrating" other languages.