4 ms·

The NY State government has a huge hang up about gambling. I've had multiple discussions with NY State liquor control and the AG's office about what they consid

The NY State government has a huge hang up about gambling. I've had multiple discussions with NY State liquor control and the AG's office about what they consider "Gambling instruments", which you cannot possess in a establishment that serves alcohol. Not Gambling instruments: Darts Chessboard & Chess Pieces (including checker pieces) Bowling Balls (and Bowling in general) Pool cues (and Pool tables & balls) Gambling Instruments (possession of any of these items is a Class A misdemeanor punishable by up to 1 year in jail): Deck of cards Dice That makes the following games illegal: Any card game (Poker, Blackjack, Rummy, Go Fish, Solitare) Yahtzee / Boggle Trivial Pursuit (just having the cards are OK for some reason) Candy Land (!!!) Just to further the point, you can shoot pool, for money, and it's not gambling. But if you carry a child's boardgame into a bar, you've violated NY State gambling laws.

csense 14y ago
Thanks for the heads up. Sometimes I carry around a deck of cards for entertainment (solitaire or 500 rummy if multiple players are available) -- it's tiny, light and doesn't depend on electronics being available. Knowing I could be arrested for this in NY makes me really not want to visit that state. And their unconstitutional stance on gun control, but I digress.
- nextstep 14y ago
  Good, stay away.
  - jacquesm 14y ago
    Mean much?
  - jessaustin 14y ago
    Yeah you guys will be totally safe from the twin scourges of guns and playing cards if HN people like this vacation elsewhere.
rprasad 14y ago
Gambling is generally waging money on an outcome determined by (a) chance or (b) the actions of others. Chess, bowling, pool, and darts are games of skill; all events in the games proceed directly from the player's actions. Players can play these games for money themselves but generally cross into gambling if they place wagers on games in which they are not participating. Boggle, Yahtzee, and Candyland (among other board games) are largely or entirely based on chance (i.e,. the dice rolls). Similarly, the card games enumerated are also games of chance (because skill is not a meaningful determinant until you reach the upper echelons of players). NY appears to have gone pretty far overboard with their enforcement of the gambling laws, but the actual laws themselves (i.e., the distinction between gambling and non-gambling) is pretty uniform across the states (excepting NJ and NV).
- jlgreco 14y ago
  In terms of potential harm to society, is there really any difference between playing pool for money, and playing poker? I can understand banning slot machines but poker? Is anybody really addicted to sitting in a bar and playing poker until they run broke? Moreso than pool?
  - rprasad 14y ago
    It depends on your POV. Arguably, playing pool for money is acceptable because it is a competition of skills, whereas poker is not acceptable because it is a competition of chance. As for poker addicts...yes, there are very many of them. during the first online poker crazy of the early 00's, many fellow classmates got put on academic probation b/c they couldn't keep their poker habit under control.
    - jlgreco 14y ago
      Online poker, sure. Any sort of electronic gaming that can be done solo is going to become an issue. But poker in a bar with other people? You're limited by how much cash you can carry with you, not by your credit limit, and by how many people in the immediate area want to play with you. I'm sure some people still manage to get a dangerous addiction to 'meatspace' poker in bars, but I am going to guess the vast majority of people who would play poker in bars are doing it mostly socially.
otoburb 14y ago
Backgammon uses dice too. That would presumably fall under the illegal game category. Hard to believe, but good to know.
- jmaygarden 14y ago
  Backgammon is a traditional gambling game. So, it definitely fits. Ever wonder about the purpose of the doubling cube [1]? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgammon#Doubling_cube http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgammon#Doubling_cube
caf 14y ago
What about a dice-rolling application on your smartphone?
duiker101 14y ago
no wait.... in the NY State you can't own a deck of cards? Did I get this right? Is this for real? Because if so this is the most crazy thing I ever read..
- jmaygarden 14y ago
  The grandparent stated that you cannot possess these items "in a establishment that serves alcohol." So, I would think that having a deck of cards elsewhere is fine.

csense 14y ago

Thanks for the heads up. Sometimes I carry around a deck of cards for entertainment (solitaire or 500 rummy if multiple players are available) -- it's tiny, light and doesn't depend on electronics being available. Knowing I could be arrested for this in NY makes me really not want to visit that state. And their unconstitutional stance on gun control, but I digress.

nextstep 14y ago
Good, stay away.
- jacquesm 14y ago
  Mean much?
- jessaustin 14y ago
  Yeah you guys will be totally safe from the twin scourges of guns and playing cards if HN people like this vacation elsewhere.

rprasad 14y ago

Gambling is generally waging money on an outcome determined by (a) chance or (b) the actions of others. Chess, bowling, pool, and darts are games of skill; all events in the games proceed directly from the player's actions. Players can play these games for money themselves but generally cross into gambling if they place wagers on games in which they are not participating. Boggle, Yahtzee, and Candyland (among other board games) are largely or entirely based on chance (i.e,. the dice rolls). Similarly, the card games enumerated are also games of chance (because skill is not a meaningful determinant until you reach the upper echelons of players). NY appears to have gone pretty far overboard with their enforcement of the gambling laws, but the actual laws themselves (i.e., the distinction between gambling and non-gambling) is pretty uniform across the states (excepting NJ and NV).

jlgreco 14y ago
In terms of potential harm to society, is there really any difference between playing pool for money, and playing poker? I can understand banning slot machines but poker? Is anybody really addicted to sitting in a bar and playing poker until they run broke? Moreso than pool?
- rprasad 14y ago
  It depends on your POV. Arguably, playing pool for money is acceptable because it is a competition of skills, whereas poker is not acceptable because it is a competition of chance. As for poker addicts...yes, there are very many of them. during the first online poker crazy of the early 00's, many fellow classmates got put on academic probation b/c they couldn't keep their poker habit under control.
  - jlgreco 14y ago
    Online poker, sure. Any sort of electronic gaming that can be done solo is going to become an issue. But poker in a bar with other people? You're limited by how much cash you can carry with you, not by your credit limit, and by how many people in the immediate area want to play with you. I'm sure some people still manage to get a dangerous addiction to 'meatspace' poker in bars, but I am going to guess the vast majority of people who would play poker in bars are doing it mostly socially.

otoburb 14y ago

Backgammon uses dice too. That would presumably fall under the illegal game category. Hard to believe, but good to know.

jmaygarden 14y ago
Backgammon is a traditional gambling game. So, it definitely fits. Ever wonder about the purpose of the doubling cube [1]? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgammon#Doubling_cube http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgammon#Doubling_cube

caf 14y ago

What about a dice-rolling application on your smartphone?

duiker101 14y ago

no wait.... in the NY State you can't own a deck of cards? Did I get this right? Is this for real? Because if so this is the most crazy thing I ever read..

jmaygarden 14y ago
The grandparent stated that you cannot possess these items "in a establishment that serves alcohol." So, I would think that having a deck of cards elsewhere is fine.