5 ms·

Most of the comments in this thread are talking about the units for personal height, weight, local road signs or for the weather forecast. Those are by far the

Most of the comments in this thread are talking about the units for personal height, weight, local road signs or for the weather forecast. Those are by far the least important things to be worried about. All of those things are local and there is no carrying cost for them. There would be a cost to change all those signs and forecasts - for no real gain. However, dimensions of physical goods are a constant recurring cost to the economy. Anything that crosses the borders for trade (all resources mined/farmed, everything manufactured) has to be dealt with in both sets of units. There is massive redundancy in fasteners, components, scales, paperwork, etc. It requires companies to keep two sets of tools (and not just wrenches, also drills, taps, dies, cutters, etc).

graeme 14y ago
Good point. In Canada, we still use imperial measures for body height and body weight, and many older folks still talk in miles and fahrenheit. But everyone adjusted to metric for less personal weights and measures, and other abstract measures. Pretty good compromise, I think.
- decasteve 14y ago
  Another Canadian here (Maritimer). With temperature I find many people talk about the weather in Celsius but the temperature of their homes/thermostats in Fahrenheit. Swimming pools also measured in Fahrenheit. Gym weights, except in Olympic lifting competition, everyone talks lbs. While in the UK I noticed everyone measures weight in stone (1 stone = 14 lbs).
  - eru 14y ago
    Yes. The gym weights I found in the UK where in kg, though.
  - dcminter 14y ago
    I used to think in stone. But I don't need to know my weight very often and when I do it's usually for ski bindings at european resorts - so now I find myself thinking in kilograms. The only non-metric unit that I think in now is miles - and there are obvious safety/legal problems in switching our speed limit road signs to kilometers.
    - jacquesm 14y ago
      No, everybody will be going just a tad slow for a while.
      - dcminter 14y ago
        Good consternoon affable. No, I thought this speedo was in KPH.
        jacquesm 14y ago
        hehe, you owe me a new keyboard :) tx
ndonnellan 14y ago
I agree the examples are irrelevant. A better example (from my experience) would be the oil/gas/chemical industry where you have millions of miles, oops kilometers, of pipes, uncountable valves, fittings, sensors, vessels, etc. What's the counterpart to a 6", sch 60 pipe? You definitely do not just convert to metric! My favorite nonsensical (not-quite-non-dimensional unit)? Heat rate: MMBtu per MWh
- VolatileVoid 14y ago
  Another nonsensical conversion? MMCF to MMBtu or, worse, 10^3m^3 to MMBtu.
podperson 14y ago
The gain would be psychological. If people use metric units in day-to-day things, the rest will fall out naturally.
JoeAltmaier 14y ago
THe 'sets of tools' argument is kind of spurious. I already have a box full of wrenches; I'd need some more in the box. Nobody argues 'lets get rid of 5/32 bolts, so I can get rid of that wrench'. Its the mental effort to rationalize them that is the real cost. Lets see, slightly larger than 1/4 - is it 7mm? or 8? or 9/32?
- Xylakant 14y ago
  When I had the tires on my buell motorcycle changed the guy here in germany only had metric wrenches. He had to "fix" one to get the wheel of.
- krschultz 14y ago
  I was talking about the factory floor. Even if we switched to metric tomorrow, you would still need wrenches to work on things made before the switch. But cutting tools are consumable. You need new drills, taps, dies, and cutters all the time. Manufacturers have to stock twice as many because of metric and imperial. Those are big ticket expenses.
sb 14y ago
I agree that it is all about cost, however this is far more "local" to many US citizens than they might imagine. For example, most of the coke bottles outside of the US come in half litres, while in the US they come in 20 fluid ounces (this is certainly true for many other products, too.) Hence, companies that make coke filling machines must accommodate the imperial system on top of the metric system, as well. Given that the metric system company can easily grab most of the market share, it should eventually be able to get larger economies of scale. In the end, it could very well be that machinery to supply imperial unit sized products becomes more expensive, a cost that will most certainly be relegated to the consumer.
- SoftwareMaven 14y ago
  That would probably work if the US economy wasn't so big. In reality, it isn't until you get to niche products that it will be possible (and ay have happened); anything as mainstream as a Coke bottle will be fine in imperial.
thomseddon 14y ago
Quite right. I just finished a civil engineering degree and found that despite the vast amounts of published academic research and literature from the US, the use of imperial units rendered a very large proportion virtually unusable. Its an inherently empirical subject and continual conversion was both incredibly tedious and introduced a likely source of error (you get "an eye" for metric units so you can quickly tell if you are obviously an order out from where you should be).

graeme 14y ago

Good point. In Canada, we still use imperial measures for body height and body weight, and many older folks still talk in miles and fahrenheit. But everyone adjusted to metric for less personal weights and measures, and other abstract measures. Pretty good compromise, I think.

decasteve 14y ago
Another Canadian here (Maritimer). With temperature I find many people talk about the weather in Celsius but the temperature of their homes/thermostats in Fahrenheit. Swimming pools also measured in Fahrenheit. Gym weights, except in Olympic lifting competition, everyone talks lbs. While in the UK I noticed everyone measures weight in stone (1 stone = 14 lbs).
- eru 14y ago
  Yes. The gym weights I found in the UK where in kg, though.
- dcminter 14y ago
  I used to think in stone. But I don't need to know my weight very often and when I do it's usually for ski bindings at european resorts - so now I find myself thinking in kilograms. The only non-metric unit that I think in now is miles - and there are obvious safety/legal problems in switching our speed limit road signs to kilometers.
  - jacquesm 14y ago
    No, everybody will be going just a tad slow for a while.
    - dcminter 14y ago
      Good consternoon affable. No, I thought this speedo was in KPH.
      - jacquesm 14y ago
        hehe, you owe me a new keyboard :) tx

ndonnellan 14y ago

I agree the examples are irrelevant. A better example (from my experience) would be the oil/gas/chemical industry where you have millions of miles, oops kilometers, of pipes, uncountable valves, fittings, sensors, vessels, etc. What's the counterpart to a 6", sch 60 pipe? You definitely do not just convert to metric! My favorite nonsensical (not-quite-non-dimensional unit)? Heat rate: MMBtu per MWh

VolatileVoid 14y ago
Another nonsensical conversion? MMCF to MMBtu or, worse, 10^3m^3 to MMBtu.

podperson 14y ago

The gain would be psychological. If people use metric units in day-to-day things, the rest will fall out naturally.

JoeAltmaier 14y ago

THe 'sets of tools' argument is kind of spurious. I already have a box full of wrenches; I'd need some more in the box. Nobody argues 'lets get rid of 5/32 bolts, so I can get rid of that wrench'. Its the mental effort to rationalize them that is the real cost. Lets see, slightly larger than 1/4 - is it 7mm? or 8? or 9/32?

Xylakant 14y ago
When I had the tires on my buell motorcycle changed the guy here in germany only had metric wrenches. He had to "fix" one to get the wheel of.
krschultz 14y ago
I was talking about the factory floor. Even if we switched to metric tomorrow, you would still need wrenches to work on things made before the switch. But cutting tools are consumable. You need new drills, taps, dies, and cutters all the time. Manufacturers have to stock twice as many because of metric and imperial. Those are big ticket expenses.

sb 14y ago

I agree that it is all about cost, however this is far more "local" to many US citizens than they might imagine. For example, most of the coke bottles outside of the US come in half litres, while in the US they come in 20 fluid ounces (this is certainly true for many other products, too.) Hence, companies that make coke filling machines must accommodate the imperial system on top of the metric system, as well. Given that the metric system company can easily grab most of the market share, it should eventually be able to get larger economies of scale. In the end, it could very well be that machinery to supply imperial unit sized products becomes more expensive, a cost that will most certainly be relegated to the consumer.

SoftwareMaven 14y ago
That would probably work if the US economy wasn't so big. In reality, it isn't until you get to niche products that it will be possible (and ay have happened); anything as mainstream as a Coke bottle will be fine in imperial.

thomseddon 14y ago

Quite right. I just finished a civil engineering degree and found that despite the vast amounts of published academic research and literature from the US, the use of imperial units rendered a very large proportion virtually unusable. Its an inherently empirical subject and continual conversion was both incredibly tedious and introduced a likely source of error (you get "an eye" for metric units so you can quickly tell if you are obviously an order out from where you should be).