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I'm afraid you missed the point entirely. On Earth, there's only one business plan to find, and the humans found it ages ago. You are correct in stating that it
by alexqgb 14y ago
I'm afraid you missed the point entirely. On Earth, there's only one business plan to find, and the humans found it ages ago. You are correct in stating that it is, at heart, a base proposition. No debate there. But as with sex, the facts remain stubbornly the same.
"You are correct, but it assumes that anyone who knows this is okay with the way you operate."
Bad news, Buttercup. We all operate like this - you included. I mean if you work for a company that's bigger than a breadbox, they're going to have a legal department, and this means that you, and everyone around you, enjoys livelihoods that are ultimately backstopped by the force of law. Not the "idea" of law. The force of law. The fact that your own hands aren't getting dirty doesn't mean that somewhere done the line from which your paycheck springs, people aren't paying for carrots because the option is a stick.
Now you can try and distort the issue of you like, limiting copyright to Hollywood, but the reality of the situation is much bigger. It covers every form of media - music, movies, television, books, games, plays, poems, textbooks, scores, photographs, illustrations, even architectural plans.
Perhaps you're some ignorant philistine who cares nothing for any form of culture, and has no interest in those who do. But for the vast majority of your fellow citizens, a world without these things would be a travesty. And people like you - who clearly haven't thought about this very carefully - are paving the way.
You say, for instance, that physical production was the natural means of enforcing copyright. This is wrong. Physical production allowed publishers to control supply, which is different. Copyright - which is entierly artificial - has always had one and only one mechanism for enforcement: the courts.
Granted, in the absence of physical media, it has been much harder to locate programs in places where the rule of law protects them. But these weren't barriers to enforcement so much as barriers to theft. When they drop, theft skyrockets, placing an unmanageable burden on everyone.
So I agree that we need reform. Where I disagree - sharply - is in the idea that producers need to "figure out a new business model" on their own since, there is only one business model to figure out, and in a state ruled by law, businesses and people are flatly prohibited from taking enforcement into their own hands.
No business can survive without the protection of the law, unless it handles enforcement in a criminal fashion. And since no society can tolerate this on an appreciable scale, it is incumbent upon people to ensure that the rule of law prevails where it's needed. If that means taking the additional effort to ensure that policing is handled in ways that are fair and non-abusive, so be it. That's the hard work of developing and maintaining civilization. These are problems we need to figure out.
But saying "Find a business plan that works without copyright or admit defeat." is the kind of thing only an asshole would say. Why? Because it removes you from the equation. It implies that this isn't your problem, that you, while living in a culture that enjoys the benefits of free and vibrant creativity, have no responsibility for any of it. And it implies that "defeat" is what gets suffered by some external, alien force, not the crown jewels of your own liberal, democratic, civilization. You don't like movies, fine. But of all this things covered by copyright (conveniently listed above) can you honestly say that you don't appreciate ANY of them?
I'm sorry to burst so many bubbles in one post, but in a government of the people, by the people, for the people, in which you are one of the people, it is very much your problem. You simply cannot be a passive spectator. Not here. If something dies because is wasn't suitably protected by law, then you - and everyone around you - share some responsibility. That's the burden of self-government.
Now you've said you're not willing to accept copyright. And you haven't disputed the basic facts of business. And I presume you're not willing to wash your hands of nearly every form of culture developed in the last two centuries which is what happen if every enterprise was reduced to the status of buskers.
So what are your ideas for inflicting the pain that is a necessary part of doing business among humans? What's the source? What's the vector? Taxes on ISPs that are enforced by the IRS? Taxes on property that are collected by the states? You've said what you won't do. But what WILL you do in terms of supporting the enforcement that no producer can legally provide for themselves? Anything? Do you have ANY ideas at all? Or are those of us on the production side trying to work with people who have abdicated their responsibilities for the defining the legal portion of any equation?
We're artists, for god's sake, not legislators. There are absolute legal limits on what we can and cannot do on our own. Telling me I need to figure out a business model that doesn't demand legal protection is the same as telling anyone they need to figure out a business model that doesn't demand legal protection. It's stupid, it's oblivious to the facts of life, and it needs to end.
Ultimately, this is your culture, from the trashy bits to the brilliant. If you want it to see another generation, you need to be part of the conversation surrounding its survival and development. Specifically, you need to be clear about what kind of protection you're going to offer the people who pour their lives into this. That's the deal. People who make the stuff are doing their part. Now kindly step up and do yours.
- ynniv 14y agoI mean if you work for a company that's bigger than a breadbox, they're going to have a legal department, and this means that you, and everyone around you, enjoys livelihoods that are ultimately backstopped by the force of law. Your problem is that you don't realize the profound effect of free, perfect duplication of media. And you think that I haven't thought about this at all, probably because I don't share your professional experiences. limiting copyright to Hollywood Nope, never said that. If you were paying attention, I said "Find a business plan that works without copyright or admit defeat". People who sell software by the copy? Yep, they're screwed. People who sell books about comparative literature? Screwed. Budding photographer? I think you see where this is going. As you say, this covers all media. Pretty sure I was articulate in saying "media". This becomes an argument about Hollywood because I haven't seen any professional photographers lobbying congress to record everything that happens on the Internet in case someone doesn't pay to use their photographs. You say, for instance, that physical production was the natural means of enforcing copyright. This is wrong. I'm sorry, but you've gone off the rails here. Where is the legal protection of food recipes (not the copyright of their text, but the performance of them)? Or combinations of clothing? It takes effort and skill to come up with good combinations, that investment should be protected. These things are not legally protected because anyone can do it, and so there is no means of enforcement. Copyright worked because printing presses were big and expensive, and the owners colluded to reduce market competition. It was essentially an opt-in system that was beneficial to participants. Modern copying is so trivial that nearly 100% of the time you don't even realize you're doing it. Even when you play by the DRM rules, there is plenty of intermediary copying being done on your behalf. How do you expect to enforce any of this? that means accepting a framework that will MAKE you pay in the event you refuse to I don't accept that. Laws are not so arbitrary, and indeed there are consumer protection laws to shield people from undue "enforcement". But you can't force people to pay for the smell of food, or their unauthorized performance of the latest pop hit in the shower, or copying data. To create a society in which enforcement of these is possible requires a distortion that does more damage to society than the property it protects. eternal vigilance is the price of liberty Indeed, and it appears that you are on the wrong side of it. EDIT: Wow, your comment is like twice as long now. Now you've said you're not willing to accept copyright. Actually, no. I have said that I pay for my copyrighten material. My argument not so shortsighted. My argument is that copyright is, essentially, doomed. If you are still able to enforce it now, you will not be able to enforce it real soon. I also said that you should come up with a new business plan, which you have violently rejected. Ultimately, that's cool... you'll just find your business to be increasingly less profitable until you have to make money some other way. It isn't a threat, it's a warning. So what are your ideas for inflicting the pain that is a necessary part of doing business among humans? Yes, let's start here. I get the impression that you're highly passionate about what you do, which is probably why I'm still replying. You want to continue to do so for the rest of your life, and possibly pass something on to your children. And to that end, you think that convincing me that I am wrong will help you. It won't. I'm the lighthouse telling the aircraft carrer to divert its course: honestly, it's your call. But looking for a means of forcing people to obey your will is too brutish, simplistic, and obvious. It won't work. You need something that makes people feel good about how they rewarded someone who deserved it. There is both the stick and the carrot. Do you have ANY ideas at all? Well, not really. If I did, I would be the first person in line to start a business around it. Maybe it looks like advertising or product placement. Maybe films that are only shown in cinemas. Edward Bernays made money selling pianos by influencing contemporary homebuilding culture to include "music" rooms that people usually filled with pianos. Telling me I need to figure out a business model that doesn't demand legal protection is the same as telling anyone they need to figure out a business model that doesn't demand legal protection. It's stupid, it's oblivious to the facts of life, and it needs to end. You are really in the wrong forum to say things like that. You need to be clear about what kind of protection you're going to offer the people who pour their lives into this. That's the deal. People who make the stuff are doing their part. Now kindly step up and do yours. How is that my part? I understand most of what you're saying, but cut the dramatics and face the reality. We all pur our lives into what we do. Everyone, all over the globe. Just because what you do has been profitable for a small number of people over the last 50 years doesn't mean it will continue to be. To say you aren't responsible for your position of affluence reflects pretty negatively on you.