4 ms·

I disagree, the problem is the tool. Generating text instead of thinking about what text to use explicitly is not writing, and it's not worthy of someone else r

by duped 5d ago

I disagree, the problem is the tool. Generating text instead of thinking about what text to use explicitly is not writing, and it's not worthy of someone else reading it. Fundamental to exchanging ideas is discovering which ideas should be exchanged and how to express them. The process of writing itself is that exercise. If you use a tool to outsource the thinking then you're not thinking.

AlexandrB 5d ago
I definitely think that "not thinking about what you're writing" is a big danger with AI-generated text, but it's not a given. If you generate a block of text and then go through and edit it to better reflect your ideas and voice - that's the thinking process in action. It's also entirely possible to generate slop by manually typing every word - see any corporate communication ever.
- timacles 5d ago
  You will NEVER be a good to great writer if you use AI to seed your writing and then edit it. _Everything_ AI generates, is generalized slop. All of your ideas will be boring and derivative. Mediocre writers will be improved, but the best would only have their ability to think dulled. Just think through it from the perspective that AI is generating art for you instead of writing. What would all art look like if good artists used it for ideas and "edited" it? It would look like generic, derivative shit. A perpetual crutch that the person can never abandon.
- duped 5d ago
  I just fundamentally do not agree with you. If you are editing AI generated text to "better reflect your ideas and voice" you are still not using your ideas or your voice. There's no 'thinking process in action' if you've delegated the hardest part of the task to a text predictor! It really bothers me that people think it's ok to use AI as the starting point for writing. In my mind, it's the worst thing you can do. It poisons the entire effort, and frankly it's disrespectful to give it to anyone to read. Stop doing it!
  - orangeboats 5d ago
    There are just times that we stumble upon writer's block. Personally I have had multiple instances of me knowing the idea I want to express, but utterly failing to articulate it in a way that's understood by most people. And I unfortunately do not have a human assistant, so for a second opinion on how to articulate the idea better, I turn to an LLM. (Yes, I am using my own idea!) I write something, ask the LLM whether it understood what I said, and make adjustments based on that. In this case, the text is 100% written by me, and the LLM is no more different than a random passer-by giving me advices. But there are also times when the idea is so complicated that I don't really have a good idea on how to untangle all of that. Ideas that live in your brain as a bunch of abstract concepts, if you can get it. If I were to untangle all of that myself - it's fairly good chance that I'll just leave it for "another day" (read: abandoned). I won't be investing any more thinking into it, LLM or not. So LLM it is. I dump my ideas (as a bunch of incomprehensible human gibberish ;P) into it, make it make sense of the ideas, generate an ideas-untangled paragraph, which I use as an inspiration (or basis, or template, or whichever word you think suits it) for writing my own text with my own voice and my own style. I was able to continue thinking because the LLM keeps my attention from drifting away! (I always suspected I have some kinda ADHD, but shrug) I understand where people are coming from when they reject all forms of LLM assistance in writing, it's just that I hope people don't turn it into a dogma of some sort.

by duped 5d ago

AlexandrB 5d ago

I definitely think that "not thinking about what you're writing" is a big danger with AI-generated text, but it's not a given. If you generate a block of text and then go through and edit it to better reflect your ideas and voice - that's the thinking process in action. It's also entirely possible to generate slop by manually typing every word - see any corporate communication ever.

timacles 5d ago
You will NEVER be a good to great writer if you use AI to seed your writing and then edit it. _Everything_ AI generates, is generalized slop. All of your ideas will be boring and derivative. Mediocre writers will be improved, but the best would only have their ability to think dulled. Just think through it from the perspective that AI is generating art for you instead of writing. What would all art look like if good artists used it for ideas and "edited" it? It would look like generic, derivative shit. A perpetual crutch that the person can never abandon.
duped 5d ago
I just fundamentally do not agree with you. If you are editing AI generated text to "better reflect your ideas and voice" you are still not using your ideas or your voice. There's no 'thinking process in action' if you've delegated the hardest part of the task to a text predictor! It really bothers me that people think it's ok to use AI as the starting point for writing. In my mind, it's the worst thing you can do. It poisons the entire effort, and frankly it's disrespectful to give it to anyone to read. Stop doing it!
- orangeboats 5d ago
  There are just times that we stumble upon writer's block. Personally I have had multiple instances of me knowing the idea I want to express, but utterly failing to articulate it in a way that's understood by most people. And I unfortunately do not have a human assistant, so for a second opinion on how to articulate the idea better, I turn to an LLM. (Yes, I am using my own idea!) I write something, ask the LLM whether it understood what I said, and make adjustments based on that. In this case, the text is 100% written by me, and the LLM is no more different than a random passer-by giving me advices. But there are also times when the idea is so complicated that I don't really have a good idea on how to untangle all of that. Ideas that live in your brain as a bunch of abstract concepts, if you can get it. If I were to untangle all of that myself - it's fairly good chance that I'll just leave it for "another day" (read: abandoned). I won't be investing any more thinking into it, LLM or not. So LLM it is. I dump my ideas (as a bunch of incomprehensible human gibberish ;P) into it, make it make sense of the ideas, generate an ideas-untangled paragraph, which I use as an inspiration (or basis, or template, or whichever word you think suits it) for writing my own text with my own voice and my own style. I was able to continue thinking because the LLM keeps my attention from drifting away! (I always suspected I have some kinda ADHD, but shrug) I understand where people are coming from when they reject all forms of LLM assistance in writing, it's just that I hope people don't turn it into a dogma of some sort.