3 ms·

This is a really useful taxonomy and illustrative stories... But these stories imply an ordering which is neither essential nor factual in most cases! Check ou

This is a really useful taxonomy and illustrative stories... But these stories imply an ordering which is neither essential nor factual in most cases! Check out Graber's "Debt: The first 5000 Years" for some really interesting analysis, including how debt almost always preceded hard currency in early societies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt:_The_First_5,000_Years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt:_The_First_5,000_Years

gwgundersen 13d ago
I've read "Debt" and responded more fully here [1]. But I'm curious: given your reading of "Debt", what ordering would you change in my post besides the myth of barter? My sense is that people are reacting to the first couple sentences and missing the entire rest of the post. I don't really see how Graeber is related to the Fed funds rate or currency pegs, e.g. Of course money is political, and I could have framed everything in terms of state violence and control, but that's essentially a different blog post. I don't think that adds a lot of clarity for what mechanically happens at Jackson Hole. Happy to hear how I'm wrong. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49785213 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49785213
- evrydayhustling 12d ago
  100%, that's why I led with the post being useful as-is -- you don't have to shift your view to Graeber's because we can always link to it as a supplement :). IMO part of why myth-of-barter has persisted is because it has worked for helping folks understand our modern finance system (among other reasons, b/c many folks building that system grew up on it as well). So it makes sense to use in an explainer. With that said, it doesn't feel to me like it detracts from anything to start with obligation before currency. Markers of past favors seems like as easy a place to start as trading stones.

3 ms·

This is a really useful taxonomy and illustrative stories... But these stories imply an ordering which is neither essential nor factual in most cases! Check ou

by evrydayhustling 13d ago

gwgundersen 13d ago
I've read "Debt" and responded more fully here [1]. But I'm curious: given your reading of "Debt", what ordering would you change in my post besides the myth of barter? My sense is that people are reacting to the first couple sentences and missing the entire rest of the post. I don't really see how Graeber is related to the Fed funds rate or currency pegs, e.g. Of course money is political, and I could have framed everything in terms of state violence and control, but that's essentially a different blog post. I don't think that adds a lot of clarity for what mechanically happens at Jackson Hole. Happy to hear how I'm wrong. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49785213 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49785213
- evrydayhustling 12d ago
  100%, that's why I led with the post being useful as-is -- you don't have to shift your view to Graeber's because we can always link to it as a supplement :). IMO part of why myth-of-barter has persisted is because it has worked for helping folks understand our modern finance system (among other reasons, b/c many folks building that system grew up on it as well). So it makes sense to use in an explainer. With that said, it doesn't feel to me like it detracts from anything to start with obligation before currency. Markers of past favors seems like as easy a place to start as trading stones.