4 ms·

There's a sort of generational ennui, in that the traditional milestones of adulthood have largely been eroded in the last sevenish decades and we're raised wit

by patio11 14y ago

There's a sort of generational ennui, in that the traditional milestones of adulthood have largely been eroded in the last sevenish decades and we're raised with a clear set of expectations and paths for success (and feeling successful, being seen as successful, and being told we're successful) which function right up until age 22, at which point life loses virtually all out-of-the-box structure and you have to supply your own. Some people adjust to that transition better than others. Random advice? Don't hang around with anybody who routinely asks "Why am I a loser?". There is a tight feedback loop. (This is a subset of the more general rule "Associate more with people who you'd like to be like and less with people who you wouldn't like to be like.") You know those guys who say that exercise and diet cure almost everything? They're a lot more right than I would have credited them 10 years ago. If job / career / $$$ are not primary happiness drivers for you (which is Totally OK), then figure out what is and take the obvious steps towards getting them.

pirer 14y ago
Job / career / $$$ shouldn't be primary happiness drivers for anyone.
- ovi256 14y ago
  I'm sorry, but that's a very naive and dangerous view. Being satisfied by what you do has always been a good goal, and society has always rewarded you for doing well at your job. I can't see what angle you are coming from, so I can't give you a specific refutation, I hope it was novel.
  - mping 14y ago
    You don't want a job for job's sake. You want it to earn money to spend it somewhere else. Here's an heuristic for you: imagine you are old and are dying. What things would you like to say on your deathbed? "I had a great job, great career, earned lots of money"? Or maybe "I had a great life/kids/wife/contribution to society/whatever"? Before answering, take some time to really imagine the situation. Don't give a knee-jerk answer. "
    - tzaman 14y ago
      It's not one or the other. Having a good job/career and in turn $$$ means you can contribute more to the society, and provide for your family better. So on my deathbed, I'd like to say: "I was good at making $$$ which allowed me to spend more time with my family, give some to charities and see a good portion of my mother earth with the ones I love."
    - corin_ 14y ago
      Personally family/kids are a big part of what I want from life, but there are people out there who don't actually want that. Job may not be everything, just as kids may not be everything (find my a homeless person who has had kids and tell me his life is perfect), but that doesn't mean that a career can't be enjoyable and a big positive in your life, not just a necessity.
    - itsboring 14y ago
      Maybe those are your priorities, but I don't think you should apply them to everyone else and then accuse them of not taking time to think it through if they don't share your priorities. Of the things you listed, only two are really concrete (wife, kids) and some people don't have those things, sometimes by choice. "Great life" could mean different things to different people and I'm not sure what "contribution to society" entails. Charitable works, volunteering? Again, this could mean all sorts of things; some people see raising good kids as contributing to society, while others might consider their work important to society (for example, medical research, clean energy, advancements in computer science, etc.) If I spend at least 8 hours of every weekday working, that's an enormous portion of my life. So, going back to the death bed scenario, you better bet I don't want to be like "well, I spent a huge portion of my life sleeping, and another huge portion working a mediocre job, but the rest was pretty good." I'd rather be able to say that I had a rewarding and challenging career that gave me satisfaction (above and beyond just money for survival and comfort). Many people value wife/kids and see their job as just a paycheck and there's nothing wrong with that. But some people look for different things, and yes, that can include one's career and professional life. And some people are a mix of the two. To assume that it's just about money is to project your own view on everyone else.
  - pirer 14y ago
    >> I can't see what angle you are coming from, so I can't give you a specific refutation, I hope it was novel. Why would you downvote or even refutate instead of asking? Those shouldn't be your primary drivers but it doesn't mean you won't have them. I don't measure happiness with those variables, they are a result of what makes me happy, a consequence.
  - angersock 14y ago
    society has always rewarded you for doing well at your job. This is far from the case, and even trivial reflection presents us with many counterexamples (military veterans, construction workers, folks from NASA, etc.).
  - eshvk 14y ago
    He/She said it shouldn't be a primary driver. I am not seeing how both of you are saying dynamically different things unless your use of the term "Being satisfied" means "I love my job and it is the main thing in my life that drives me".
codegeek 14y ago
"Associate more with people who you'd like to be like and less with people who you wouldn't like to be like" This. I always tell exactly this to my friends who come to me for advice related to career. You want to be a successful manager/executive ? Try and associate with those. You don't want to be a loser in life ? Stop associating with ppl who always think so about themselves. Overall, associate with people who you think are better than you in the context of things that you wish to achieve.
- init0 14y ago
  I don't want to be like my co-workers, but I still need to be with them :\ I want to be one amongst the great developers, with whom I'm already coding :) So this is kina mixed emotions. I'm so there, but still so far!
ahh 14y ago
> Don't hang around with anybody who routinely asks "Why am I a loser?". This is probably great advice for any individual, but really screws your friends who are depressed or otherwise in bad places. How would you like it if you felt like a failure, were sad all the time, and then all your friends stopped talking to you because you were a downer?
meric 14y ago
"Don't hang around with anybody who routinely asks "Why am I a loser?". " What if they're people you care about?
init0 14y ago
Awesome advice! :) I don't want to be like my co-workers, but I still need to be with them :\ I want to be one amongst the great developers, with whom I'm already coding :) So this is kina mixed emotions. I'm so there, but still so far!

by patio11 14y ago

pirer 14y ago

Job / career / $$$ shouldn't be primary happiness drivers for anyone.

ovi256 14y ago
I'm sorry, but that's a very naive and dangerous view. Being satisfied by what you do has always been a good goal, and society has always rewarded you for doing well at your job. I can't see what angle you are coming from, so I can't give you a specific refutation, I hope it was novel.
- mping 14y ago
  You don't want a job for job's sake. You want it to earn money to spend it somewhere else. Here's an heuristic for you: imagine you are old and are dying. What things would you like to say on your deathbed? "I had a great job, great career, earned lots of money"? Or maybe "I had a great life/kids/wife/contribution to society/whatever"? Before answering, take some time to really imagine the situation. Don't give a knee-jerk answer. "
  - tzaman 14y ago
    It's not one or the other. Having a good job/career and in turn $$$ means you can contribute more to the society, and provide for your family better. So on my deathbed, I'd like to say: "I was good at making $$$ which allowed me to spend more time with my family, give some to charities and see a good portion of my mother earth with the ones I love."
  - corin_ 14y ago
    Personally family/kids are a big part of what I want from life, but there are people out there who don't actually want that. Job may not be everything, just as kids may not be everything (find my a homeless person who has had kids and tell me his life is perfect), but that doesn't mean that a career can't be enjoyable and a big positive in your life, not just a necessity.
  - itsboring 14y ago
    Maybe those are your priorities, but I don't think you should apply them to everyone else and then accuse them of not taking time to think it through if they don't share your priorities. Of the things you listed, only two are really concrete (wife, kids) and some people don't have those things, sometimes by choice. "Great life" could mean different things to different people and I'm not sure what "contribution to society" entails. Charitable works, volunteering? Again, this could mean all sorts of things; some people see raising good kids as contributing to society, while others might consider their work important to society (for example, medical research, clean energy, advancements in computer science, etc.) If I spend at least 8 hours of every weekday working, that's an enormous portion of my life. So, going back to the death bed scenario, you better bet I don't want to be like "well, I spent a huge portion of my life sleeping, and another huge portion working a mediocre job, but the rest was pretty good." I'd rather be able to say that I had a rewarding and challenging career that gave me satisfaction (above and beyond just money for survival and comfort). Many people value wife/kids and see their job as just a paycheck and there's nothing wrong with that. But some people look for different things, and yes, that can include one's career and professional life. And some people are a mix of the two. To assume that it's just about money is to project your own view on everyone else.
- pirer 14y ago
  >> I can't see what angle you are coming from, so I can't give you a specific refutation, I hope it was novel. Why would you downvote or even refutate instead of asking? Those shouldn't be your primary drivers but it doesn't mean you won't have them. I don't measure happiness with those variables, they are a result of what makes me happy, a consequence.
- angersock 14y ago
  society has always rewarded you for doing well at your job. This is far from the case, and even trivial reflection presents us with many counterexamples (military veterans, construction workers, folks from NASA, etc.).
- eshvk 14y ago
  He/She said it shouldn't be a primary driver. I am not seeing how both of you are saying dynamically different things unless your use of the term "Being satisfied" means "I love my job and it is the main thing in my life that drives me".

codegeek 14y ago

"Associate more with people who you'd like to be like and less with people who you wouldn't like to be like" This. I always tell exactly this to my friends who come to me for advice related to career. You want to be a successful manager/executive ? Try and associate with those. You don't want to be a loser in life ? Stop associating with ppl who always think so about themselves. Overall, associate with people who you think are better than you in the context of things that you wish to achieve.

init0 14y ago
I don't want to be like my co-workers, but I still need to be with them :\ I want to be one amongst the great developers, with whom I'm already coding :) So this is kina mixed emotions. I'm so there, but still so far!

ahh 14y ago

> Don't hang around with anybody who routinely asks "Why am I a loser?". This is probably great advice for any individual, but really screws your friends who are depressed or otherwise in bad places. How would you like it if you felt like a failure, were sad all the time, and then all your friends stopped talking to you because you were a downer?

meric 14y ago

"Don't hang around with anybody who routinely asks "Why am I a loser?". " What if they're people you care about?

init0 14y ago

Awesome advice! :) I don't want to be like my co-workers, but I still need to be with them :\ I want to be one amongst the great developers, with whom I'm already coding :) So this is kina mixed emotions. I'm so there, but still so far!