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> [I learned it] "at school" - I learned it at school, I'm not specifying which school > [I learned it] "at the school" - I learned it at school, the one that

> [I learned it] "at school" - I learned it at school, I'm not specifying which school > [I learned it] "at the school" - I learned it at school, the one that was referenced That's not the distinction that the OP is making. If you say "I am at school", it means you are a student, you attend school. If you say "I am at THE school", it means you are physically at the school building, without specifying whether you are a student. Both of those options are different from saying "at a school." See also "prison", "work", "bed". Similar distinction (in UK English, not so much American English) with "in hospital" vs "in the hospital." As was pointed out, "I go to the dentist every year" doesn't necessarily mean a particular dentist; it just means some dentist, but we use the definite article anyway, because I guess we consider all dentists interchangeable? We don't use definite articles even when we are referring to a specific thing in specific phrases, such as "I went to Florida by [the] car." Then there's highly idiomatic use of articles with proper nouns. We say "Buckingham Palace" [no article] but "The Washington Monument" [definite article]. We talk about "The Rockies" [definite article] but "Mount Fuji" [no article]. "Germany" but "The United States." Sometimes we use the definite article when referring to to racial or ethnic groups, and sometimes we don't, and that choice can have complicated social implications ("The Blacks", anyone?). In short, if a native English speaker tells you that article use is straightforward, then they simply have not considered all the cases.

abraxas 14d ago
Here I have no idea why in the last sentence you wrote "all the cases" even though cases is already plural. This is not covered by any of the rules people have been posting in this thread. I'm the GP who started the article usage discussion here.
- hackyhacky 14d ago
  I have no idea why I shouldn't write "all the cases". What are you trying to say?
  - abraxas 14d ago
    The word "cases" is already plural. Why does it need an article in front of it? It's one of the usages that trip me up. Why isn't it just "all cases"?
    - bonoboTP 14d ago
      It seems like a shortening of "all of the cases", but I'm not a native speaker.
    - hackyhacky 14d ago
      We frequently use definite articles with plurals. It simply identifies a bounded or known set. * I understand all languages. -- unbounded set, applies to every language, everywhere * I understand all the languages. -- bounded set, applies to a known set of languages, i.e. specifically those languages which are supported by a particular program To be fair, I think "all cases" in this situation is also acceptable.
    - danadam 14d ago
      To me, as non-native, it seems that it may be because the idea [1] of "cases" was already introduced. So, at the start of a conversation you would say: - The rules of a/the are simple. - Not really, if you think so, then you haven't considered _all cases_. There's this exception and there's that exception. [...] but: - The rules of a/the are simple. - Not really. There's this exception and there's that exception. [...] If you think the rules are simple, then you haven't considered _all the cases_. [1] but take what I write with a big grain of salt, I can't explain why I wrote "the idea" or "the start" and I'm not 100% sure if that's correct :)
      - thaumasiotes 13d ago
        - For "the idea" and "the start", your usage is correct and changing it would be incorrect. - I don't think the explanation of "all cases" vs "all the cases" fully works. I agree with other commenters that in this example, either phrase might be used. (Whether the sentences comes after a point-by-point discussion or before.) To me, the version without the has a less natural feeling. You might describe it as more formal, or more stilted, or more abrupt, but the main point is that it's going to be somewhat dispreferred. There isn't necessarily a reason for the preference to tilt one way or the other.
thaumasiotes 13d ago
> If you say "I am at school", it means you are a student, you attend school. If you say "I am at THE school", it means you are physically at the school building, without specifying whether you are a student. Both of those options are different from saying "at a school." See also "prison", "work", "bed". Similar distinction (in UK English, not so much American English) with "in hospital" vs "in the hospital." Your description is incomplete. I agree that "I'm at school" carries at least a strong implication that you are a student at that school, but it also carries the denotation that the school is where you are currently physically located. If you want to specify that you are currently a student without claiming that you're currently on the premises, you would need to say "I'm in school", though that particular expression (a) doesn't specify which school you attend, and (b) can't be altered to provide that information (which is to say, you can't replace "school" with the name of a school). To get there, you need to change the verb; you can say "I attend Florida State", at which point the stative inflection on attend makes it clear that you aren't discussing your current physical location. The hospital example is pretty much the same. Being "in the hospital" is analogous to being "in school", a fact about your current status rather than your current location. For your location you'd want to use "at", which doesn't have the same weird thing going on in "at the hospital" that it does in "at school".
- hackyhacky 12d ago
  > The hospital example is pretty much the same. Being "in the hospital" is analogous to being "in school", No. To be "in hospital" or to go "to hospital" means that you are a patient. To be "in the hospital" describes only location. > Your description is incomplete Your analysis is fine, but does not contradict my comment and moreover is irrelevant to the present discussion, which pertains to the subtle use of articles in English.
  - thaumasiotes 12d ago
    > No. To be "in hospital" or to go "to hospital" means that you are a patient. To be "in the hospital" describes only location. >>> in UK English, not so much American English --- > Your analysis is fine, but does not contradict my comment and moreover is irrelevant to the present discussion, which pertains to the subtle use of articles in English. As you can see from the dialectal difference you've already described, what you're talking about isn't really related to "the subtle use of articles in English". American English and British English agree on how their articles are used. Where they agree on "in school" and disagree on "in hospital", you can recognize that usage in those phrases, rather than revealing some kind of subtle point about how the is used in nearly-identical contexts, is determined arbitrarily.

abraxas 14d ago

Here I have no idea why in the last sentence you wrote "all the cases" even though cases is already plural. This is not covered by any of the rules people have been posting in this thread. I'm the GP who started the article usage discussion here.

hackyhacky 14d ago
I have no idea why I shouldn't write "all the cases". What are you trying to say?
- abraxas 14d ago
  The word "cases" is already plural. Why does it need an article in front of it? It's one of the usages that trip me up. Why isn't it just "all cases"?
  - bonoboTP 14d ago
    It seems like a shortening of "all of the cases", but I'm not a native speaker.
  - hackyhacky 14d ago
    We frequently use definite articles with plurals. It simply identifies a bounded or known set. * I understand all languages. -- unbounded set, applies to every language, everywhere * I understand all the languages. -- bounded set, applies to a known set of languages, i.e. specifically those languages which are supported by a particular program To be fair, I think "all cases" in this situation is also acceptable.
  - danadam 14d ago
    To me, as non-native, it seems that it may be because the idea [1] of "cases" was already introduced. So, at the start of a conversation you would say: - The rules of a/the are simple. - Not really, if you think so, then you haven't considered _all cases_. There's this exception and there's that exception. [...] but: - The rules of a/the are simple. - Not really. There's this exception and there's that exception. [...] If you think the rules are simple, then you haven't considered _all the cases_. [1] but take what I write with a big grain of salt, I can't explain why I wrote "the idea" or "the start" and I'm not 100% sure if that's correct :)
    - thaumasiotes 13d ago
      - For "the idea" and "the start", your usage is correct and changing it would be incorrect. - I don't think the explanation of "all cases" vs "all the cases" fully works. I agree with other commenters that in this example, either phrase might be used. (Whether the sentences comes after a point-by-point discussion or before.) To me, the version without the has a less natural feeling. You might describe it as more formal, or more stilted, or more abrupt, but the main point is that it's going to be somewhat dispreferred. There isn't necessarily a reason for the preference to tilt one way or the other.

thaumasiotes 13d ago

> If you say "I am at school", it means you are a student, you attend school. If you say "I am at THE school", it means you are physically at the school building, without specifying whether you are a student. Both of those options are different from saying "at a school." See also "prison", "work", "bed". Similar distinction (in UK English, not so much American English) with "in hospital" vs "in the hospital." Your description is incomplete. I agree that "I'm at school" carries at least a strong implication that you are a student at that school, but it also carries the denotation that the school is where you are currently physically located. If you want to specify that you are currently a student without claiming that you're currently on the premises, you would need to say "I'm in school", though that particular expression (a) doesn't specify which school you attend, and (b) can't be altered to provide that information (which is to say, you can't replace "school" with the name of a school). To get there, you need to change the verb; you can say "I attend Florida State", at which point the stative inflection on attend makes it clear that you aren't discussing your current physical location. The hospital example is pretty much the same. Being "in the hospital" is analogous to being "in school", a fact about your current status rather than your current location. For your location you'd want to use "at", which doesn't have the same weird thing going on in "at the hospital" that it does in "at school".

hackyhacky 12d ago
> The hospital example is pretty much the same. Being "in the hospital" is analogous to being "in school", No. To be "in hospital" or to go "to hospital" means that you are a patient. To be "in the hospital" describes only location. > Your description is incomplete Your analysis is fine, but does not contradict my comment and moreover is irrelevant to the present discussion, which pertains to the subtle use of articles in English.
- thaumasiotes 12d ago
  > No. To be "in hospital" or to go "to hospital" means that you are a patient. To be "in the hospital" describes only location. >>> in UK English, not so much American English --- > Your analysis is fine, but does not contradict my comment and moreover is irrelevant to the present discussion, which pertains to the subtle use of articles in English. As you can see from the dialectal difference you've already described, what you're talking about isn't really related to "the subtle use of articles in English". American English and British English agree on how their articles are used. Where they agree on "in school" and disagree on "in hospital", you can recognize that usage in those phrases, rather than revealing some kind of subtle point about how the is used in nearly-identical contexts, is determined arbitrarily.