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Who's going to pick the fruits and harvest the vegetables? Those are not jobs Americans want, among many more. Trump is using the system at levels like no one

Who's going to pick the fruits and harvest the vegetables? Those are not jobs Americans want, among many more. Trump is using the system at levels like no one has seen before, perhaps he could set an example "Trump Organization requested record number of foreign workers in 2025" https://thehill.com/business/5603478-trump-organization-foreign-workers-2025/ https://thehill.com/business/5603478-trump-organization-fore...

mushi_shi 21d ago
Famously H-1B jobs /s
bigyabai 21d ago
Not so much that, but doctors, ATC, and other skilled labor the US needs and can't replace with AI. Is it better to scale back hospitals and airports instead of filling those jobs?
- sergiotapia 21d ago
  They can be skilled doctors back in their own countries. I want prospects for my children.
  - bigyabai 21d ago
    Here's a prospect for them; war. Do you like that? It's where they're headed, living here. Fact is, your kid could start working 40 hours a week at age 18 for the next 50 years, and still not receive a proper pension. The government won't have any money left for them, and even if they did the economy probably wouldn't be ready to pay it back. Their brilliant future is enlistment in a war half a world a way, to bleed on foreign soil and see their government ignore them. Hope they're planning accordingly.
  - ryan_n 21d ago
    This is absolutely hilarious and so incredibly misguided... I promise you that Mohamed the neurosurgeon is not the reason your children are not able to become doctors.
    - Danox 21d ago
      See China, Korea or Japan, Mohammed, who?
      - verdverm 20d ago
        Omar Yahgi, a nobel laureate in chemistry, is moving from the US to China, originally from Jordan https://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/09/science/nobel-winning-us-chemist-will-move-to-china-to-lead-ai-institute.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/09/science/nobel-winning-us-... Here's one on Japan and foreign workers https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49734139 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49734139
  - verdverm 21d ago
    It's worth noting that we already have a shortage of doctors and many that are choosing not to practice. Radiology is a well known example
- mushi_shi 21d ago
  The US would have more doctors tomorrow if they invested in US citizens and not foreign workers..
  - bigyabai 21d ago
    Out of taxpayer's pocketbooks? The Fed isn't running a charity, there's 40 trillion dollars of debt that we all share.
    - mushi_shi 21d ago
      The country works for the citizens or it isn't a functioning country. They can take the 40 trillion from the people leveraging H-1Bs over domestic labor.
  - verdverm 21d ago
    training up doctors takes ~10 years the current administration and republican party regularly put down the very institutions needed to do what you want there's a saying about cake that is appropriate here
    - mushi_shi 21d ago
      Better start tomorrow, and no one but you mentioned the current admin or the republican party. Projecting much? Yes, and the people saying let them eat cake are the same ones promoting H-1Bs, they will end the same.
      - verdverm 21d ago
        > no one but you mentioned the current admin or the republican party does not make it irrelevant, the stance you have is the same they have, while they also have another stance that works directly against it, I don't know your stance on universities the saying about cake I meant to imply was about getting to have it and eat it too, as applied to the party in power holding views that work against each other I personally think that nurse practitioners is something to emphasize, maybe more so than doctors, for the non-emergency medical care that underdeliver for in this country while paying twice as much as the next closest country I'd start with the basics here, reading and math competency levels are largely headed the wrong direction. Mississippi has done wonders for their reading, re: phonics, and I hope other states follow suite
ckrapu 21d ago
Conversely, the question should be "Who is preventing American agriculture from mechanizing?" Or, if you are such a pessimist in America's can-do attitude, instead take it from the point of view of market efficiency. If a good cannot be produced cheaply enough for the market to sustain it, the solution is not to modify the social contract and undermine the value of labor for the sake of the good. We have always solved problems by innovation. The surest way to prevent innovation is to continually provide cheaper and cheaper labor. The Roman empire is an excellent example of this. Undoubtedly, these issues are more complex. However, this is such a tired old canard. Wages make labor, scarcity makes innovation.
- verdverm 21d ago
  > Undoubtedly, these issues are more complex. agreed, two points toward this are 1. American agriculture is largely mechanic already, which removes the labor completely 2. food is non-discretionary, caveats about choices of what king of "food" eg. fast vs healthy
  - ckrapu 21d ago
    The part of American agriculture which employs illegal immigrants is clearly not mechanized; they are not driving combines and are tending vegetables by hand. Types of food really are discretionary. Beans are an excellent vegetable and can be raised completely without manual labor. Trading salad greens for them would not be an overall nutritional loss. Perhaps the true market price for a head of lettuce should be 1.6x in a properly labor regime. To draw the distinction more clearly, suppose we had zero illegal immigrants working in the field and someone said “let’s reduce the price of some vegetables by a third and create a permanent underclass”. Does that sound reasonable?
    - verdverm 21d ago
      in assuming illegal immigrants, bias may be perceived by others, we have visas for temporary farm workers https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary-workers/h-2a-temporary-agricultural-workers https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary...
variadix 21d ago
Sounds a lot like “who is going to pick the cotton?” to me.

mushi_shi 21d ago

Famously H-1B jobs /s

bigyabai 21d ago

Not so much that, but doctors, ATC, and other skilled labor the US needs and can't replace with AI. Is it better to scale back hospitals and airports instead of filling those jobs?

sergiotapia 21d ago
They can be skilled doctors back in their own countries. I want prospects for my children.
- bigyabai 21d ago
  Here's a prospect for them; war. Do you like that? It's where they're headed, living here. Fact is, your kid could start working 40 hours a week at age 18 for the next 50 years, and still not receive a proper pension. The government won't have any money left for them, and even if they did the economy probably wouldn't be ready to pay it back. Their brilliant future is enlistment in a war half a world a way, to bleed on foreign soil and see their government ignore them. Hope they're planning accordingly.
- ryan_n 21d ago
  This is absolutely hilarious and so incredibly misguided... I promise you that Mohamed the neurosurgeon is not the reason your children are not able to become doctors.
  - Danox 21d ago
    See China, Korea or Japan, Mohammed, who?
    - verdverm 20d ago
      Omar Yahgi, a nobel laureate in chemistry, is moving from the US to China, originally from Jordan https://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/09/science/nobel-winning-us-chemist-will-move-to-china-to-lead-ai-institute.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/07/09/science/nobel-winning-us-... Here's one on Japan and foreign workers https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49734139 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49734139
- verdverm 21d ago
  It's worth noting that we already have a shortage of doctors and many that are choosing not to practice. Radiology is a well known example
mushi_shi 21d ago
The US would have more doctors tomorrow if they invested in US citizens and not foreign workers..
- bigyabai 21d ago
  Out of taxpayer's pocketbooks? The Fed isn't running a charity, there's 40 trillion dollars of debt that we all share.
  - mushi_shi 21d ago
    The country works for the citizens or it isn't a functioning country. They can take the 40 trillion from the people leveraging H-1Bs over domestic labor.
- verdverm 21d ago
  training up doctors takes ~10 years the current administration and republican party regularly put down the very institutions needed to do what you want there's a saying about cake that is appropriate here
  - mushi_shi 21d ago
    Better start tomorrow, and no one but you mentioned the current admin or the republican party. Projecting much? Yes, and the people saying let them eat cake are the same ones promoting H-1Bs, they will end the same.
    - verdverm 21d ago
      > no one but you mentioned the current admin or the republican party does not make it irrelevant, the stance you have is the same they have, while they also have another stance that works directly against it, I don't know your stance on universities the saying about cake I meant to imply was about getting to have it and eat it too, as applied to the party in power holding views that work against each other I personally think that nurse practitioners is something to emphasize, maybe more so than doctors, for the non-emergency medical care that underdeliver for in this country while paying twice as much as the next closest country I'd start with the basics here, reading and math competency levels are largely headed the wrong direction. Mississippi has done wonders for their reading, re: phonics, and I hope other states follow suite

ckrapu 21d ago

Conversely, the question should be "Who is preventing American agriculture from mechanizing?" Or, if you are such a pessimist in America's can-do attitude, instead take it from the point of view of market efficiency. If a good cannot be produced cheaply enough for the market to sustain it, the solution is not to modify the social contract and undermine the value of labor for the sake of the good. We have always solved problems by innovation. The surest way to prevent innovation is to continually provide cheaper and cheaper labor. The Roman empire is an excellent example of this. Undoubtedly, these issues are more complex. However, this is such a tired old canard. Wages make labor, scarcity makes innovation.

verdverm 21d ago
> Undoubtedly, these issues are more complex. agreed, two points toward this are 1. American agriculture is largely mechanic already, which removes the labor completely 2. food is non-discretionary, caveats about choices of what king of "food" eg. fast vs healthy
- ckrapu 21d ago
  The part of American agriculture which employs illegal immigrants is clearly not mechanized; they are not driving combines and are tending vegetables by hand. Types of food really are discretionary. Beans are an excellent vegetable and can be raised completely without manual labor. Trading salad greens for them would not be an overall nutritional loss. Perhaps the true market price for a head of lettuce should be 1.6x in a properly labor regime. To draw the distinction more clearly, suppose we had zero illegal immigrants working in the field and someone said “let’s reduce the price of some vegetables by a third and create a permanent underclass”. Does that sound reasonable?
  - verdverm 21d ago
    in assuming illegal immigrants, bias may be perceived by others, we have visas for temporary farm workers https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary-workers/h-2a-temporary-agricultural-workers https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary...

variadix 21d ago

Sounds a lot like “who is going to pick the cotton?” to me.