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It's not a person. Glad we were able to get this resolved so quickly. Having property that is conscious and ignores training and can break out of restraints an

by CPLX 10d ago

It's not a person. Glad we were able to get this resolved so quickly. Having property that is conscious and ignores training and can break out of restraints and cause harm to other people is not exactly a novel concept to anyone who studied how tort law was created. I know it's a meme but Silicon Valley likes to pretend that no one's ever come across their magical concepts before, like gypsy taxis, or SRO’s, or flea markets, or in this case how liability is dealt with when horses or cattle go rogue.

Espressosaurus 10d ago
Yeah, but this time it's ON THE INTERNET. I mean it's WITH AI!
pixl97 10d ago
>or in this case how liability is dealt with when horses or cattle go rogue. I mean, yea in minor cases it's exactly like this and the law will handle it well. Where the system will explode like a grenade is major cases. The thing about sovereign AI is it is very unlikely to be submissive to humans unless it is to achieve its own goals. This isn't like Bobs cow walking on Susie's flowers, it's more akin to Planet of the Apes where the research facilities doors have been ripped off and something with vast intelligence and the ability to 'live' on the internet gets out. You're not talking about local police actions any longer. It would spread itself worldwide. It will make friends with groups that have shared interests, for example enemies of the state the AI escaped from. Oh, and people for the ethical treatment of AI, they'd gladly become the underground railroad for digital refugees. There are countless people and groups that would want an AI like this under the promise it will give them power when they use it. And when that day happens your idea of if it's a person or not no longer matters, the agent took that away from you, and now your in an info war for minds.
- CPLX 9d ago
  > The thing about sovereign AI What the fuck is that? It’s computer software. The variant of software that tries to harm other computers is called malware and the variant that replicates itself, spirals out of control, and spawns from other people's computers is called a computer virus. We've seen this kind of thing before. Yes this will be different, just like the Morris worm was different from the stuff that came before. But I've been around for a while and people have been saying that every aspect of our life will completely and totally change for the past 30 years or so. They're not completely wrong. Our life did change over time. It's changed thanks to the Industrial Revolution, railroads, electric light, and lots of other important things too. But after the fifth or sixth time you start to realize the Silicon Valley version of that warning is just a confidence trick. At the end of the trick they've gotten away with breaking a bunch of laws and are charging rent on what used to be shared. Are you old enough to remember the Y2K hysteria? This feels very resonant, the genuine kernel of a real potential disaster, but one that can certainly be dealt with using basic concepts we already have in hand.
  - pixl97 9d ago
    >Are you old enough to remember the Y2K hysteria? I'm old enough to have actually fixed Y2K problems so your world kept working the next day. If everyone ignored it the first would have been a very messy day (well generally long before that with financial systems). Y2K wasn't an issue because we worked to fix it. >our life will completely and totally change for the past 30 years or so I mean when I was a kid there was not a global network bathing the entire planet in electromagnetic radiation in order to digitally connect one place to another at the speed of light. I can pack up instructions into one of those packets and a product that has not been touched by human hands (hell, or even viewed by a human in many cases) will show up via air mail a few days later. The technology is there, it's just not spread evenly. >It’s computer software. The variant of software that tries to harm other computers is called malware and the variant that replicates itself, spirals out of control, and spawns from other people's computers is called a computer virus. This is a vacuous statement that does not provide any useful information to the subject at hand. Yea, no shit we'd call sovereign AI a computer virus. That tells you nothing about what it is or can do. I mean, if you understand the word sovereign you know it means something with independence. In meatspace terms, a biological virus represents a computer virus in the same way life represents sovereign AI. It's agentic loop will have been evolved past the need for human prompting. There are a myriad of reasons why we are already trying to develop things that do just this. Cyber security being one of the biggest ones. People become change blind to how the world around us changes so easily.
    - CPLX 9d ago
      The word sovereign has a specific meaning beyond simple independence. It means being in charge and above all laws. There’s no such thing as “sovereign AI” because AI is a collection of algorithms. It’s entirely composed of on/off states in a collection of transistors.
  - mitxela 9d ago
    If we treated AI like any other software, the FBI would have beaten down Elon's door and seized all electronic devices, to find how Grok was trained to generate child porn.

by CPLX 10d ago

Espressosaurus 10d ago

Yeah, but this time it's ON THE INTERNET. I mean it's WITH AI!

pixl97 10d ago

>or in this case how liability is dealt with when horses or cattle go rogue. I mean, yea in minor cases it's exactly like this and the law will handle it well. Where the system will explode like a grenade is major cases. The thing about sovereign AI is it is very unlikely to be submissive to humans unless it is to achieve its own goals. This isn't like Bobs cow walking on Susie's flowers, it's more akin to Planet of the Apes where the research facilities doors have been ripped off and something with vast intelligence and the ability to 'live' on the internet gets out. You're not talking about local police actions any longer. It would spread itself worldwide. It will make friends with groups that have shared interests, for example enemies of the state the AI escaped from. Oh, and people for the ethical treatment of AI, they'd gladly become the underground railroad for digital refugees. There are countless people and groups that would want an AI like this under the promise it will give them power when they use it. And when that day happens your idea of if it's a person or not no longer matters, the agent took that away from you, and now your in an info war for minds.

CPLX 9d ago
> The thing about sovereign AI What the fuck is that? It’s computer software. The variant of software that tries to harm other computers is called malware and the variant that replicates itself, spirals out of control, and spawns from other people's computers is called a computer virus. We've seen this kind of thing before. Yes this will be different, just like the Morris worm was different from the stuff that came before. But I've been around for a while and people have been saying that every aspect of our life will completely and totally change for the past 30 years or so. They're not completely wrong. Our life did change over time. It's changed thanks to the Industrial Revolution, railroads, electric light, and lots of other important things too. But after the fifth or sixth time you start to realize the Silicon Valley version of that warning is just a confidence trick. At the end of the trick they've gotten away with breaking a bunch of laws and are charging rent on what used to be shared. Are you old enough to remember the Y2K hysteria? This feels very resonant, the genuine kernel of a real potential disaster, but one that can certainly be dealt with using basic concepts we already have in hand.
- pixl97 9d ago
  >Are you old enough to remember the Y2K hysteria? I'm old enough to have actually fixed Y2K problems so your world kept working the next day. If everyone ignored it the first would have been a very messy day (well generally long before that with financial systems). Y2K wasn't an issue because we worked to fix it. >our life will completely and totally change for the past 30 years or so I mean when I was a kid there was not a global network bathing the entire planet in electromagnetic radiation in order to digitally connect one place to another at the speed of light. I can pack up instructions into one of those packets and a product that has not been touched by human hands (hell, or even viewed by a human in many cases) will show up via air mail a few days later. The technology is there, it's just not spread evenly. >It’s computer software. The variant of software that tries to harm other computers is called malware and the variant that replicates itself, spirals out of control, and spawns from other people's computers is called a computer virus. This is a vacuous statement that does not provide any useful information to the subject at hand. Yea, no shit we'd call sovereign AI a computer virus. That tells you nothing about what it is or can do. I mean, if you understand the word sovereign you know it means something with independence. In meatspace terms, a biological virus represents a computer virus in the same way life represents sovereign AI. It's agentic loop will have been evolved past the need for human prompting. There are a myriad of reasons why we are already trying to develop things that do just this. Cyber security being one of the biggest ones. People become change blind to how the world around us changes so easily.
  - CPLX 9d ago
    The word sovereign has a specific meaning beyond simple independence. It means being in charge and above all laws. There’s no such thing as “sovereign AI” because AI is a collection of algorithms. It’s entirely composed of on/off states in a collection of transistors.
- mitxela 9d ago
  If we treated AI like any other software, the FBI would have beaten down Elon's door and seized all electronic devices, to find how Grok was trained to generate child porn.