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> Vietnam hasn't been sanctioned for decades following the war. Why can't the US and Israel get over the Shah being overthrown? We've tried but then they fund

by ericmay 21d ago

> Vietnam hasn't been sanctioned for decades following the war. Why can't the US and Israel get over the Shah being overthrown? We've tried but then they fund all these militias and kill lots of people and keep trying to build nuclear bombs. What if they stop doing those things? > You are trying to use events from antiquity to dilute or excuse events done within living timeframes. You realize lots of Iranians lived during the Iran-Iraq war, yes? You know the US supported Saddam as he was gassing them, yes? These are things people who still live experienced. By that logic Iran should thank us for getting rid of Saddam. Do you remember (or are you even aware) of things like the Atoms for Peace program? Why does/did Iran have F-14 fighter jets? Arab nations also supported Iraq during the war. You are over-simplifying and cherry-picking while ignoring the fact that international relations is a lot more complicated than "country did X, therefore enemies for all time". USS Cole, Lebanon, it's not like Iran is innocent. And before you go and say well what about 1953, well then you can just keep going back to some other slight or injustice. If you want to live in a world of forever wars, by my guest. I think we should give peace a chance but that requires Iran to stop certain activities that simply do not serve anyone but a tiny minority of theocrats and despots. > I hope that provides some insight as to why Iran hates the US. Iran and the Iranian people don't hate the US and we don't hate them. Iran's autocratic government hates us and they can't pursue a path of peace because authoritarian regimes need external enemies to direct popular anger against to cover up for their own shortcomings. It's a common playbook that we're all well aware of.

jst1fthsdys 21d ago
> We've tried No we didn't. Well, we tried the JCPOA eventually, but that got nuked by Trump. > By that logic Iran should thank us for getting rid of Saddam. Yeah, thanks for killing the guy you used to gas and slaughter our people. All water under the bridge now, even though you provided that support for him to gas and kill us. > Atoms for Peace program How is this relevant? > Why does/did Iran have F-14 fighter jets? They seized them when they overthrew the Shah. > I think we should give peace a chance Then the US should show some good faith and release frozen funds and lift sanctions. To expect Iran to weaken themselves when the west has shown perfidy time and time again is, frankly, ridiculous. The war going on now has only made that more impossible. > Iran and the Iranian people don't hate the US and we don't hate them. They may not hate the average American, but they hate our ruling class. And I assure you, our ruling class hates them all. They are racist fascists, it's what they do. You are naive if you think people like Rubio or Trump give two shits about Iranians. They want to destabilize a regional power and exploit natural resources. The best way to do that would be to throw Iran into chaos so no one faction controls power. It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die.
- ericmay 21d ago
  > No we didn't. Well, we tried the JCPOA eventually, but that got nuked by Trump. Yes we did try. We shouldn't have needed a JCPOA, Iran should just not have pursued nuclear weapons. Atoms for Peace program, for example. Why did/does Iran have F-14s? Iran had the JCPOA and was still funding militants who were going around and killing people. Package deal. > They seized them when they overthrew the Shah. When did they overthrow the Shah? > Then the US should show some good faith and release frozen funds and lift sanctions. To expect Iran to weaken themselves when the west has shown perfidy time and time again is, frankly, ridiculous. The war going on now has only made that more impossible. We can do that once Iran commits to dismantling their nuclear weapons program among other things. > They may not hate the average American, but they hate our ruling class. And I assure you, our ruling class hates them all. They are racist fascists, it's what they do. You are naive if you think people like Rubio or Trump give two shits about Iranians. They want to destabilize a regional power and exploit natural resources. The best way to do that would be to throw Iran into chaos so no one faction controls power. It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die. If you want to argue this point of view, then I would just argue that we don't hate Iran's people but we hate their ruling class. They're all murderous theocrats and they don't give two shits about peace they only want to destabilize the Middle East so they can export their mafia control over oil to enrich themselves. They want to destabilize the region so that they can exert power, enslave people, rape women, and murder at will. Where does this get us? Forever war. Is that what you want? If so, maintain this perspective. > It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die. Millions of Iraqis didn't die. Though many thousands did because of Iran. Iraq is a lot better off now than it was in 2002 before the war. They have a functioning parliament, for example.
  - jst1fthsdys 21d ago
    > Yes we did try. We shouldn't have needed a JCPOA, Iran should just not have pursued nuclear weapons. Atoms for Peace program, for example. Why did/does Iran have F-14s? Iran had the JCPOA and was still funding militants who were going around and killing people. Package deal. Are you trying to say that the AfP program and the F14 sale were the attempts to try? You realize those were done prior to the Islamic revolution, right? What attempts outside of the JCPOA have been tried during the rule of the current government? > When did they overthrow the Shah? You might want to do some basic research before you speak on a topic. The shah was overthrown in 79. After Atoms for Peace, after the F14s were delivered (79 of 80, the last not delivered because of the revolution). > We can do that once Iran commits to dismantling their nuclear weapons program among other things. They did when they committed to the JCPOA. Then the US backed out. Perfidy, same as the negotiations during this war. > If you want to argue this point of view, then I would just argue that we don't hate Iran's people but we hate their ruling class. Yes, I said that. Our ruling class and their cronies hate them because they are dirty savage muslims who embarrassed the US multiple times. > They're all murderous People adapt to the environments they are in. The US forces violence on these people, they are violent in return. Tit for tat. > theocrats Our Secretary of (losing) War has Deus Vult tattooed on him and is in an insane catholic fascist offshoot. They have referenced this war on Iran as being a religious crusade many times. Our ruling class is largely zionist and support them because of end time prophecies. > and they don't give two shits about peace they only want to destabilize the Middle East so they can export their mafia control over oil to enrich themselves. The only thing they are destabilizing is the US imperialism in the ME and the various fascist Arab rulers that support it. "Mafia control over oil" doesn't even make sense. States are entitled to control over territory and waterways near them. If you don't want them to assert their control don't start a fucking war. > They want to destabilize the region so that they can exert power, enslave people, rape women, and murder at will. Ah yes, there it is. Mask off chauvinism. Not that it was hard to tell to begin with. Funny, of course, coming from a citizen of the nation who still has slavery, exports death globally, and runs torture black sites (not to mention supports the Israelis who rape people with dogs). > Where does this get us? Forever war. Is that what you want? If so, maintain this perspective. The US can surrender and admit defeat. Food for thought. > Millions of Iraqis didn't die. Though many thousands did because of Iran. Iraq is a lot better off now than it was in 2002 before the war. They have a functioning parliament, for example. Please read, I said millions of Iranians. Nearly a million people died from the GWOT, and that was before genocide was deemed normal and kosher. The suffering will be greater. Anyway, it's clear you think Iran should have no sovereignty or free will and should just acquiesce to any and all US demands. Not much else to be said here.

by ericmay 21d ago

jst1fthsdys 21d ago

> We've tried No we didn't. Well, we tried the JCPOA eventually, but that got nuked by Trump. > By that logic Iran should thank us for getting rid of Saddam. Yeah, thanks for killing the guy you used to gas and slaughter our people. All water under the bridge now, even though you provided that support for him to gas and kill us. > Atoms for Peace program How is this relevant? > Why does/did Iran have F-14 fighter jets? They seized them when they overthrew the Shah. > I think we should give peace a chance Then the US should show some good faith and release frozen funds and lift sanctions. To expect Iran to weaken themselves when the west has shown perfidy time and time again is, frankly, ridiculous. The war going on now has only made that more impossible. > Iran and the Iranian people don't hate the US and we don't hate them. They may not hate the average American, but they hate our ruling class. And I assure you, our ruling class hates them all. They are racist fascists, it's what they do. You are naive if you think people like Rubio or Trump give two shits about Iranians. They want to destabilize a regional power and exploit natural resources. The best way to do that would be to throw Iran into chaos so no one faction controls power. It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die.

ericmay 21d ago
> No we didn't. Well, we tried the JCPOA eventually, but that got nuked by Trump. Yes we did try. We shouldn't have needed a JCPOA, Iran should just not have pursued nuclear weapons. Atoms for Peace program, for example. Why did/does Iran have F-14s? Iran had the JCPOA and was still funding militants who were going around and killing people. Package deal. > They seized them when they overthrew the Shah. When did they overthrow the Shah? > Then the US should show some good faith and release frozen funds and lift sanctions. To expect Iran to weaken themselves when the west has shown perfidy time and time again is, frankly, ridiculous. The war going on now has only made that more impossible. We can do that once Iran commits to dismantling their nuclear weapons program among other things. > They may not hate the average American, but they hate our ruling class. And I assure you, our ruling class hates them all. They are racist fascists, it's what they do. You are naive if you think people like Rubio or Trump give two shits about Iranians. They want to destabilize a regional power and exploit natural resources. The best way to do that would be to throw Iran into chaos so no one faction controls power. It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die. If you want to argue this point of view, then I would just argue that we don't hate Iran's people but we hate their ruling class. They're all murderous theocrats and they don't give two shits about peace they only want to destabilize the Middle East so they can export their mafia control over oil to enrich themselves. They want to destabilize the region so that they can exert power, enslave people, rape women, and murder at will. Where does this get us? Forever war. Is that what you want? If so, maintain this perspective. > It would be another Iraq situation and millions of Iranians would die. Millions of Iraqis didn't die. Though many thousands did because of Iran. Iraq is a lot better off now than it was in 2002 before the war. They have a functioning parliament, for example.
- jst1fthsdys 21d ago
  > Yes we did try. We shouldn't have needed a JCPOA, Iran should just not have pursued nuclear weapons. Atoms for Peace program, for example. Why did/does Iran have F-14s? Iran had the JCPOA and was still funding militants who were going around and killing people. Package deal. Are you trying to say that the AfP program and the F14 sale were the attempts to try? You realize those were done prior to the Islamic revolution, right? What attempts outside of the JCPOA have been tried during the rule of the current government? > When did they overthrow the Shah? You might want to do some basic research before you speak on a topic. The shah was overthrown in 79. After Atoms for Peace, after the F14s were delivered (79 of 80, the last not delivered because of the revolution). > We can do that once Iran commits to dismantling their nuclear weapons program among other things. They did when they committed to the JCPOA. Then the US backed out. Perfidy, same as the negotiations during this war. > If you want to argue this point of view, then I would just argue that we don't hate Iran's people but we hate their ruling class. Yes, I said that. Our ruling class and their cronies hate them because they are dirty savage muslims who embarrassed the US multiple times. > They're all murderous People adapt to the environments they are in. The US forces violence on these people, they are violent in return. Tit for tat. > theocrats Our Secretary of (losing) War has Deus Vult tattooed on him and is in an insane catholic fascist offshoot. They have referenced this war on Iran as being a religious crusade many times. Our ruling class is largely zionist and support them because of end time prophecies. > and they don't give two shits about peace they only want to destabilize the Middle East so they can export their mafia control over oil to enrich themselves. The only thing they are destabilizing is the US imperialism in the ME and the various fascist Arab rulers that support it. "Mafia control over oil" doesn't even make sense. States are entitled to control over territory and waterways near them. If you don't want them to assert their control don't start a fucking war. > They want to destabilize the region so that they can exert power, enslave people, rape women, and murder at will. Ah yes, there it is. Mask off chauvinism. Not that it was hard to tell to begin with. Funny, of course, coming from a citizen of the nation who still has slavery, exports death globally, and runs torture black sites (not to mention supports the Israelis who rape people with dogs). > Where does this get us? Forever war. Is that what you want? If so, maintain this perspective. The US can surrender and admit defeat. Food for thought. > Millions of Iraqis didn't die. Though many thousands did because of Iran. Iraq is a lot better off now than it was in 2002 before the war. They have a functioning parliament, for example. Please read, I said millions of Iranians. Nearly a million people died from the GWOT, and that was before genocide was deemed normal and kosher. The suffering will be greater. Anyway, it's clear you think Iran should have no sovereignty or free will and should just acquiesce to any and all US demands. Not much else to be said here.