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Cardio machines are innocent enough, as they won’t actually make you any less fit, but maintaining cardiovascular fitness doesn’t really take much more than bre

by spudlyo 14y ago

Cardio machines are innocent enough, as they won’t actually make you any less fit, but maintaining cardiovascular fitness doesn’t really take much more than breathing uncomfortably hard for about 20 minutes, three times a week. And we all know that swimming, hoops, bike riding, and even Ultimate Frisbee can get the job done, and that treadmills or elliptical trainers are a pale substitute. I think the author is overlooking one of the great benefits of elliptical trainers. They get the job done and they're very safe. If you're an obese out of shape person you're unlikely to get hurt getting your cardio in on an elliptical, whereas activities like hoops, bike riding, and Ultimate Frisbee can really fuck you up. If you wear a heart monitor and keep your HR in the appropriate zones the elliptical can be a safe, effective cardio workout. I spent three years doing hour long cardio sessions 3-5 days a week, with around 60% of that hour spent in the high end of the aerobic zone. At the end of it I had lost a considerable amount of weight, and I had a resting HR of 38.

dredmorbius 14y ago
There are alternatives to cardio machines that are far less expensive. A jump rope or kettlebell can provide ample and safe workouts for most. The advantage of activities (basketball, cycling, Ultimate) is that they're engaging, getting past the "but it's sooooo boring" issue of just grinding out your 20 minutes. And at the high end of the out-of-shape scale, just getting out of the house and walking would be a great start.
- spudlyo 14y ago
  I agree that walking is a great start, but your body will quickly adapt and unless you're walking up hills you're unlikely to get to aerobic HR levels.
  - dredmorbius 14y ago
    There are plenty of progressions available for walking.
- eru 14y ago
  > A jump rope or kettlebell can provide ample and safe workouts for most. Or just the floor (burpees). Or sprinting up stairs.
  - dredmorbius 14y ago
    I'm assuming someone who's pretty out of shape. I was a bit hesitant to put a jump rope in there, but (given coordination) it should be fairly safe. KB swings are surprisingly aerobic and very low impact.
    - eru 14y ago
      Yes, skipping rope is only trivial if you already learned how to do it earlier. Walking / running up stairs is an easy way to get in intense exercise without much stress on your joints. KB swings are fine. Just need equipment. If one is fairly out of shape, than one can benefit from very simplified burpees: just lie on the floor, get up, lie down again. With speed. Add jumping, once you are fitter. Then add negatives of push ups. And full push ups later.
      - dredmorbius 14y ago
        "Stand-ups" included in T-Nation's "Seven Cardio Drills that Don't Suck": http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/7_cardio_drills_that_dont_suck http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai...
lacosaes0 14y ago
To be fair, bike riding and swimming don't hit very hard your joints. Furthermore, you have to be very obese to receive a big hit in your joints if you're running/sprinting (using a good pair of shoes). So in other words those kind of machines are not the best tools for most of the people out there and I think that the article is about that: optimizing your time to reach your goals and free-weight training is a great option (if not the best) for the majority.
ncphillips 14y ago
If you're goal is fat loss, not cardiovascular health, then lifting weights works just as well as running or using the elliptical, and it is easier on your body if you learn the correct form.
- spudlyo 14y ago
  Strap an HR monitor on your chest when you do your next weight lifting routine, have it estimate your calories burned. Spend the same amount of time doing cardio at > 70% of your age predicted HR max. I think you'll find it's not even close. Of course you said fat loss, and perhaps you'll quibble about how much of the calories burned comes from fat vs. muscle, but I think more people are trying to get to a healthy weight rather than achieve a single digit body fat percentage.
  - analog 14y ago
    "I think you'll find it's not even close." Fairly similar for me actually, my heart rate goes pretty high when I'm lifting. When people say healthy weight surely they always mean healthy body fat percentage?
  - nordsieck 14y ago
    Sure - cardio is more efficient at burning calories than lifting... while you are exercising. The point is that anaerobic exercise builds muscle, which boosts your basal metabolic rate. Unless you're doing cardio several hours per day, lifting will be much more efficient. edit: minor word change for clarity.
  - jimzvz 14y ago
    Even easier than that is just to not eat those calories in the first place. With resistance training you are not trying to burn calories, you are building muscle. This new muscle will need calories to support itself and will make it easier to lose fat in the future because your body will need more calories to function.
  - dredmorbius 14y ago
    > Strap an HR monitor on your chest when you do your next weight lifting routine I've done that a few times. Consistently 140-160 BPM, peaking higher, sustained over 40-80 minutes. My peak during Tabata sets is 180-190 BPM, so lifting isn't quite at that rate, but it's decidedly aerobic, especially for mid-high range sets (5-20 reps).
subsection1h 14y ago
I think the author is overlooking one of the great benefits of elliptical trainers. I think the greatest benefit of ellipticals is the opportunity to read while exercising. I have a computer and monitor dedicated to my elliptical with the monitor raised to eye level.
- usaar333 14y ago
  In all fairness, the parent is talking about cardio workouts. If you are able to read while on an elliptical, you may be getting exercise, but certainly not in the "high end of the aerobic zone".
  - thisone 14y ago
    That's highly individual. You may be unable to read while going hells bells on an eliptical (or running on a treadmill), other people can.

by spudlyo 14y ago

dredmorbius 14y ago

There are alternatives to cardio machines that are far less expensive. A jump rope or kettlebell can provide ample and safe workouts for most. The advantage of activities (basketball, cycling, Ultimate) is that they're engaging, getting past the "but it's sooooo boring" issue of just grinding out your 20 minutes. And at the high end of the out-of-shape scale, just getting out of the house and walking would be a great start.

spudlyo 14y ago
I agree that walking is a great start, but your body will quickly adapt and unless you're walking up hills you're unlikely to get to aerobic HR levels.
- dredmorbius 14y ago
  There are plenty of progressions available for walking.
eru 14y ago
> A jump rope or kettlebell can provide ample and safe workouts for most. Or just the floor (burpees). Or sprinting up stairs.
- dredmorbius 14y ago
  I'm assuming someone who's pretty out of shape. I was a bit hesitant to put a jump rope in there, but (given coordination) it should be fairly safe. KB swings are surprisingly aerobic and very low impact.
  - eru 14y ago
    Yes, skipping rope is only trivial if you already learned how to do it earlier. Walking / running up stairs is an easy way to get in intense exercise without much stress on your joints. KB swings are fine. Just need equipment. If one is fairly out of shape, than one can benefit from very simplified burpees: just lie on the floor, get up, lie down again. With speed. Add jumping, once you are fitter. Then add negatives of push ups. And full push ups later.
    - dredmorbius 14y ago
      "Stand-ups" included in T-Nation's "Seven Cardio Drills that Don't Suck": http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/7_cardio_drills_that_dont_suck http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai...

lacosaes0 14y ago

To be fair, bike riding and swimming don't hit very hard your joints. Furthermore, you have to be very obese to receive a big hit in your joints if you're running/sprinting (using a good pair of shoes). So in other words those kind of machines are not the best tools for most of the people out there and I think that the article is about that: optimizing your time to reach your goals and free-weight training is a great option (if not the best) for the majority.

ncphillips 14y ago

If you're goal is fat loss, not cardiovascular health, then lifting weights works just as well as running or using the elliptical, and it is easier on your body if you learn the correct form.

spudlyo 14y ago
Strap an HR monitor on your chest when you do your next weight lifting routine, have it estimate your calories burned. Spend the same amount of time doing cardio at > 70% of your age predicted HR max. I think you'll find it's not even close. Of course you said fat loss, and perhaps you'll quibble about how much of the calories burned comes from fat vs. muscle, but I think more people are trying to get to a healthy weight rather than achieve a single digit body fat percentage.
- analog 14y ago
  "I think you'll find it's not even close." Fairly similar for me actually, my heart rate goes pretty high when I'm lifting. When people say healthy weight surely they always mean healthy body fat percentage?
- nordsieck 14y ago
  Sure - cardio is more efficient at burning calories than lifting... while you are exercising. The point is that anaerobic exercise builds muscle, which boosts your basal metabolic rate. Unless you're doing cardio several hours per day, lifting will be much more efficient. edit: minor word change for clarity.
- jimzvz 14y ago
  Even easier than that is just to not eat those calories in the first place. With resistance training you are not trying to burn calories, you are building muscle. This new muscle will need calories to support itself and will make it easier to lose fat in the future because your body will need more calories to function.
- dredmorbius 14y ago
  > Strap an HR monitor on your chest when you do your next weight lifting routine I've done that a few times. Consistently 140-160 BPM, peaking higher, sustained over 40-80 minutes. My peak during Tabata sets is 180-190 BPM, so lifting isn't quite at that rate, but it's decidedly aerobic, especially for mid-high range sets (5-20 reps).

subsection1h 14y ago

I think the author is overlooking one of the great benefits of elliptical trainers. I think the greatest benefit of ellipticals is the opportunity to read while exercising. I have a computer and monitor dedicated to my elliptical with the monitor raised to eye level.

usaar333 14y ago
In all fairness, the parent is talking about cardio workouts. If you are able to read while on an elliptical, you may be getting exercise, but certainly not in the "high end of the aerobic zone".
- thisone 14y ago
  That's highly individual. You may be unable to read while going hells bells on an eliptical (or running on a treadmill), other people can.