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> I also believe many of our current "allies" in the region should face similar sanctions in case you are wondering. Interesting take, coming from a nation tha

by swat535 20d ago

> I also believe many of our current "allies" in the region should face similar sanctions in case you are wondering. Interesting take, coming from a nation that has caused: - 210,296 violent civilian deaths in IRAQ - 500,000 civilians killed om Japan - 70,000 civilians killed in Vietnam - 46,000 civilians killed in Afghanistan - 3,000 civilians killed in IRAN - Threatened to exterminate Persians civilization, blown up bridges, killed children and destroyed civilian infrastructure I think United States should be sanctioned.

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oxcartctl 20d ago
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ericmay 20d ago
> - Threatened to exterminate Persians civilization, blown up bridges, killed children and destroyed civilian infrastructure Iran threatens that all the time "Death to America" so if they don't like someone saying it back to them maybe they should stop? If you want to make these kinds of body count claims, well for starters Iran killed over 30,000 of its own people recently (who knows maybe they've killed tens of thousands more over the years). Iran also made the Iraq war worse by funding insurgents, which opposed the US and the government of Iraq (which is doing much better now as a country than it was under Saddam anyway) so they are partially responsible for some of those deaths. But let's continue with this logic. While we're at it why don't we sanction China? Common estimates suggest 10s of millions dead from the Great Leap Forward (no it's not any different when you kill your own people, arguably much worse). Dramatic repression in places like Hong Kong, and continuing to threaten democratic Taiwan. Why aren't you clamoring to sanction China if you're going to bring up Japan and Vietnam? Well that's because your logic is unsound, never mind the continued hyper-focus on being critical of the United States only. Maybe all of these deaths are actually on the hands of Europeans who partitioned these gulf states in the first place. Why was France in Vietnam? Why was the UN in Korea?
- fzn7 20d ago
  Your reply is pure, distilled whataboutism.
  - ericmay 20d ago
    The premise of the OP is whataboutism. But you can take a step back and ask, well, what's the guiding framework here? Is it arbitrarily picking certain time periods to make a point? Why do we go back to "Japan" and World War II when Japan started the war and was massacring and colonizing people throughout east Asia? Why wasn't Germany mentioned in the body count? Dresden is a popular one that comes to mind. Why do we only focus on lives lost? Maybe America saved 10,000,000 Chinese from Japanese occupation so on balance we're saving lives?
    - Hikikomori 20d ago
      Yeah lets take a step back to 1953 when the British overthrew their government for wanting more profits from their oil. This lead directly to the revolution in 79, in the meantime the western "aligned" leader had suppressed all opposition except religions leaders so they were able to take over. Now you know why they shout death to America. Would you also like to know that al qaeda didn't just hate american "freedom"?
      - ericmay 20d ago
        Why stop there? Why not go back to when the Greeks made Darius mad and started the Greco-Persian wars? If you want the Iranian people to engage in a forever war against the West, this is the kind of attitude you must hold. “Some arbitrary injustice done by dead people forever justifies us to do whatever we want” isn’t a viable political or culturally progressive route to go down. Vietnam got over it. Why can’t Iran? Do they need a nuclear bomb to get over it? Will they stop hanging gay people, helping Russia, and providing militia support to destabilize Arab countries once they get what they want (whatever that is)? What date or specific thing do they need? Can anyone say? Of course not. Because totalitarian regimes always have to obsess over past injustices, perceived or real, to drum up support for the regime so that it can continue to hold power against the best interests of their people. It masks their own failures, like Tehran running out of water because their government spent all their money bombing innocent people.
ebbi 20d ago
> "I think United States should be sanctioned." They definitely should. Sick of the double standards. And the "USA can do no wrong but this tech in others' hands will be bad" takes.
HDThoreaun 19d ago
That’s a completely fair take. Countries are free to enact sanctions against the us just like they are free to enact sanctions against Iran if that’s what they want to do.

by swat535 20d ago

deleted 20d ago

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oxcartctl 20d ago

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ericmay 20d ago

> - Threatened to exterminate Persians civilization, blown up bridges, killed children and destroyed civilian infrastructure Iran threatens that all the time "Death to America" so if they don't like someone saying it back to them maybe they should stop? If you want to make these kinds of body count claims, well for starters Iran killed over 30,000 of its own people recently (who knows maybe they've killed tens of thousands more over the years). Iran also made the Iraq war worse by funding insurgents, which opposed the US and the government of Iraq (which is doing much better now as a country than it was under Saddam anyway) so they are partially responsible for some of those deaths. But let's continue with this logic. While we're at it why don't we sanction China? Common estimates suggest 10s of millions dead from the Great Leap Forward (no it's not any different when you kill your own people, arguably much worse). Dramatic repression in places like Hong Kong, and continuing to threaten democratic Taiwan. Why aren't you clamoring to sanction China if you're going to bring up Japan and Vietnam? Well that's because your logic is unsound, never mind the continued hyper-focus on being critical of the United States only. Maybe all of these deaths are actually on the hands of Europeans who partitioned these gulf states in the first place. Why was France in Vietnam? Why was the UN in Korea?

fzn7 20d ago
Your reply is pure, distilled whataboutism.
- ericmay 20d ago
  The premise of the OP is whataboutism. But you can take a step back and ask, well, what's the guiding framework here? Is it arbitrarily picking certain time periods to make a point? Why do we go back to "Japan" and World War II when Japan started the war and was massacring and colonizing people throughout east Asia? Why wasn't Germany mentioned in the body count? Dresden is a popular one that comes to mind. Why do we only focus on lives lost? Maybe America saved 10,000,000 Chinese from Japanese occupation so on balance we're saving lives?
  - Hikikomori 20d ago
    Yeah lets take a step back to 1953 when the British overthrew their government for wanting more profits from their oil. This lead directly to the revolution in 79, in the meantime the western "aligned" leader had suppressed all opposition except religions leaders so they were able to take over. Now you know why they shout death to America. Would you also like to know that al qaeda didn't just hate american "freedom"?
    - ericmay 20d ago
      Why stop there? Why not go back to when the Greeks made Darius mad and started the Greco-Persian wars? If you want the Iranian people to engage in a forever war against the West, this is the kind of attitude you must hold. “Some arbitrary injustice done by dead people forever justifies us to do whatever we want” isn’t a viable political or culturally progressive route to go down. Vietnam got over it. Why can’t Iran? Do they need a nuclear bomb to get over it? Will they stop hanging gay people, helping Russia, and providing militia support to destabilize Arab countries once they get what they want (whatever that is)? What date or specific thing do they need? Can anyone say? Of course not. Because totalitarian regimes always have to obsess over past injustices, perceived or real, to drum up support for the regime so that it can continue to hold power against the best interests of their people. It masks their own failures, like Tehran running out of water because their government spent all their money bombing innocent people.

ebbi 20d ago

> "I think United States should be sanctioned." They definitely should. Sick of the double standards. And the "USA can do no wrong but this tech in others' hands will be bad" takes.

HDThoreaun 19d ago

That’s a completely fair take. Countries are free to enact sanctions against the us just like they are free to enact sanctions against Iran if that’s what they want to do.