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I wonder how much of home construction efficiency improvements are held back by taste for traditional appearance vs. other cost/performance characteristics. Th

by xnx 18d ago

I wonder how much of home construction efficiency improvements are held back by taste for traditional appearance vs. other cost/performance characteristics. The difference in styles between residential and commercial construction is probably an example of this. Not many commercial buildings with tar paper shingled roofs.

lotsofpulp 18d ago
The only reason I can think of that houses don’t usually have metal roofs is because they cost at least double, if not triple. I have seen homeowners use metal roofs, but it’s one of the first cost reductions because a good shingle roof is already good for 30+ years. For a business, it can make more sense as it might be a more long term structure, plus it would contain more valuable items (or at least cause more loss if business is interrupted).
- rootusrootus 18d ago
  > The only reason I can think of that houses don’t usually have metal roofs is because they cost at least double, if not triple Also noise, if you live somewhere with a lot of rain. I wonder if the longevity argument really holds, too. Anecdotally, our local public housing project invested in metal roofs many years ago (less than 30, however) but a good fraction of them have been replaced since with contemporary asphalt shingles. I do not know why they failed, but the switch back to asphalt says something.
  - SoftTalker 18d ago
    To me it says that someone in the housing authority fell for a sales pitch on metal roofs. "Buy it once and never have to pay for a roof again." That person is now probably long gone, as is the salesman and likely the roofing contractor who installed it. The roof is now leaking, and the current administration looked at what they could afford and asphalt it is.
    - rootusrootus 18d ago
      I agree. The sales pitch on metal roofs is that they last twice as long as shingles, but the reality has not matched that promise. If I were replacing a leaking metal roof that cost me twice what a shingle roof would have cost, and it has been less than 30 years, I would be a fool to buy another metal roof to replace it.
    - xnx 18d ago
      > That person is now probably long gone, as is the salesman and likely the roofing contractor who installed it. AKA "I'll be gone. You'll be gone." https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/IBG_YBG https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/IBG_YBG
      - SoftTalker 18d ago
        I didn't mean to imply that there was some kind of collusion going on, but that sort of thing certainly happens too.
    - throwitaway222 18d ago
      Metal roofs for SFHs are mostly beneficial in wildland / forest areas where there are wildfires. Shingles will burn (they're made of petroleum products), while a metal roof will resist far far far longer. However this only makes sense if the rest of the structure is also just as fire resistant. Metal roofs will also last a lot longer. Their color may not, but the roof itself, as long as it was installed properly (major component here), will outlast asphalt by decades.
  - nostrademons 18d ago
    FWIW a bunch of friends of ours live in a development with metal roofs (built late 1970s) and they said it's been great. It just works, no leaks, no repairs necessary. There's probably a bit of selection bias in both directions: metal roofs that don't work get replaced with shingles and are no longer metal roofs, while metal roofs that do work have owners that don't think about them much and don't complain about them.
vel0city 18d ago
> Not many commercial buildings with tar paper shingled roofs I mean, this is kind of true and kind of untrue. There aren't a lot of commercial roofs with literal residential asphalt shingles, but many commercial roofs are things like mod bit which are practically the same concept, just a mod bit needs to handle an extremely low to flat pitch while residential shingles assume a decent pitch to the roof. Tons are also just single-ply membranes, which often don't even last as long as a good residential asphalt shingle install. Its not like every commercial building has a metal roof. Just look at this random commercial/industrial office park: https://maps.app.goo.gl/7X1NUTwrTUdH21o1A https://maps.app.goo.gl/7X1NUTwrTUdH21o1A Take a look around. You see a lot of metal roofs, yes. You also see membrane roofs. You see mod bit. And you'll even see some old built-up roofs.
fragmede 18d ago
They made a new office building a number of years ago that I had the pleasure of watching it go up. At first it was all grey concrete that they poured, but then, they hung, like giant paintings, a brick facade on the exterior and the columns. If you hadn't seen it go up, you'd think it was a brick building. I'm sure it cost extra, but looks don't have to go out the window in the name of efficiency.

by xnx 18d ago

lotsofpulp 18d ago

The only reason I can think of that houses don’t usually have metal roofs is because they cost at least double, if not triple. I have seen homeowners use metal roofs, but it’s one of the first cost reductions because a good shingle roof is already good for 30+ years. For a business, it can make more sense as it might be a more long term structure, plus it would contain more valuable items (or at least cause more loss if business is interrupted).

rootusrootus 18d ago
> The only reason I can think of that houses don’t usually have metal roofs is because they cost at least double, if not triple Also noise, if you live somewhere with a lot of rain. I wonder if the longevity argument really holds, too. Anecdotally, our local public housing project invested in metal roofs many years ago (less than 30, however) but a good fraction of them have been replaced since with contemporary asphalt shingles. I do not know why they failed, but the switch back to asphalt says something.
- SoftTalker 18d ago
  To me it says that someone in the housing authority fell for a sales pitch on metal roofs. "Buy it once and never have to pay for a roof again." That person is now probably long gone, as is the salesman and likely the roofing contractor who installed it. The roof is now leaking, and the current administration looked at what they could afford and asphalt it is.
  - rootusrootus 18d ago
    I agree. The sales pitch on metal roofs is that they last twice as long as shingles, but the reality has not matched that promise. If I were replacing a leaking metal roof that cost me twice what a shingle roof would have cost, and it has been less than 30 years, I would be a fool to buy another metal roof to replace it.
  - xnx 18d ago
    > That person is now probably long gone, as is the salesman and likely the roofing contractor who installed it. AKA "I'll be gone. You'll be gone." https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/IBG_YBG https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/IBG_YBG
    - SoftTalker 18d ago
      I didn't mean to imply that there was some kind of collusion going on, but that sort of thing certainly happens too.
  - throwitaway222 18d ago
    Metal roofs for SFHs are mostly beneficial in wildland / forest areas where there are wildfires. Shingles will burn (they're made of petroleum products), while a metal roof will resist far far far longer. However this only makes sense if the rest of the structure is also just as fire resistant. Metal roofs will also last a lot longer. Their color may not, but the roof itself, as long as it was installed properly (major component here), will outlast asphalt by decades.
- nostrademons 18d ago
  FWIW a bunch of friends of ours live in a development with metal roofs (built late 1970s) and they said it's been great. It just works, no leaks, no repairs necessary. There's probably a bit of selection bias in both directions: metal roofs that don't work get replaced with shingles and are no longer metal roofs, while metal roofs that do work have owners that don't think about them much and don't complain about them.

vel0city 18d ago

> Not many commercial buildings with tar paper shingled roofs I mean, this is kind of true and kind of untrue. There aren't a lot of commercial roofs with literal residential asphalt shingles, but many commercial roofs are things like mod bit which are practically the same concept, just a mod bit needs to handle an extremely low to flat pitch while residential shingles assume a decent pitch to the roof. Tons are also just single-ply membranes, which often don't even last as long as a good residential asphalt shingle install. Its not like every commercial building has a metal roof. Just look at this random commercial/industrial office park: https://maps.app.goo.gl/7X1NUTwrTUdH21o1A https://maps.app.goo.gl/7X1NUTwrTUdH21o1A Take a look around. You see a lot of metal roofs, yes. You also see membrane roofs. You see mod bit. And you'll even see some old built-up roofs.

fragmede 18d ago

They made a new office building a number of years ago that I had the pleasure of watching it go up. At first it was all grey concrete that they poured, but then, they hung, like giant paintings, a brick facade on the exterior and the columns. If you hadn't seen it go up, you'd think it was a brick building. I'm sure it cost extra, but looks don't have to go out the window in the name of efficiency.