2 ms·

This isn't a MAGA thing. H1-B is a bad program. I have no problem with someone getting a green card, citizenship, TPS, etc in the US. I think there should be

This isn't a MAGA thing. H1-B is a bad program. I have no problem with someone getting a green card, citizenship, TPS, etc in the US. I think there should be a lot faster routes for that. Let the software devs come in and become citizens or permanent residents, I don't care about that. What I do care about is the fact that H1-B locks immigrants to a company and tie their residence in the us to their employment. That means they'll accept lower wages and worse working conditions as they can't simply quit and switch jobs. The entire thing is designed to suppress wages in general.

superxpro12 12d ago
I remember when twitter was sold and Elon "Nazi" Musk fired like 4/5 of the staff, all that remained were H1B's
emodendroket 12d ago
If you look at it in a vacuum sure. When the same administration is actually floating the idea of making the program more coercive by making it so you can be deported immediately after losing your job I think it’s pretty reasonable to recognize the coercive nature of the program isn’t their concern.
- cogman10 12d ago
  Exactly. My entire problem with H1-B is the coercive nature of it. That is the thing that is ultimately designed to suppress wages. There's a bunch of levers you could pull to stop it from being such a huge negative, faster paths to citizenship, looser requirements for switching jobs, higher minimum salaries. All these things would improve conditions for the H1-B applicant. That's why I call it a bad program.
  - emodendroket 12d ago
    Put another way I don’t think this policy is a good way to address the issues you’re talking about because it’s just moving jobs out of the U.S. altogether.
    - chuckadams 12d ago
      Jobs that Americans weren't getting because it was cheaper to hire an H1-B indentured servant instead. The current administration will no doubt find a way to make everything worse, but they didn't start with a good program to begin with.
      - emodendroket 12d ago
        Just because the status quo isn’t good doesn’t mean we should blindly support anyone changing it even if their results will be even worse.
        chuckadams 12d ago
        I think I'm more likely to become a nun than blindly support anything from the current administration.
        emodendroket 12d ago
        Well I’m not sure you will find many people who feel the program is perfect as-is but the natural interpretation of what you said in context seemed to be that we should at least temper our criticism.
BeetleB 12d ago
> What I do care about is the fact that H1-B locks immigrants to a company They're free to change companies if the new company sponsors them. It may reset the timeline for applying for a green card, depending on the location and job type of the new job. Generally, if it's the same type of job in the same city, it doesn't reset. People (including Indians) do it all the time. Going to a country for employment and having your legal status tied to a company is pretty standard across the world. Do you know counterexamples?
- dominotw 12d ago
  > Going to a country for employment and having your legal status tied to a company is pretty standard across the world. Do you know counterexamples? TN visa
  - BeetleB 12d ago
    By counterexamples, I meant other countries where you get in via an employment visa and don't have your presence tied to the employer. TN visa is much more restrictive than H1B. Only for citizens of two countries, and only for certain professions. I know Canadians who have no hope of getting a TN visa (wrong profession), but have come on H1B.
    - dominotw 12d ago
      Its an example right? now you are shifting goalposts to be easily available to everyone or something.
      - BeetleB 12d ago
        I guess I wasn't being clear. The original comment I was responding to was: > What I do care about is the fact that H-1B locks immigrants to a company and tie their residence in the us to their employment. I am merely pointing out that most countries lock employment visas to the employer. It's fine not to like it, but I'm highlighting that this is pretty normal - the US is not an outlier.

superxpro12 12d ago

I remember when twitter was sold and Elon "Nazi" Musk fired like 4/5 of the staff, all that remained were H1B's

emodendroket 12d ago

If you look at it in a vacuum sure. When the same administration is actually floating the idea of making the program more coercive by making it so you can be deported immediately after losing your job I think it’s pretty reasonable to recognize the coercive nature of the program isn’t their concern.

cogman10 12d ago
Exactly. My entire problem with H1-B is the coercive nature of it. That is the thing that is ultimately designed to suppress wages. There's a bunch of levers you could pull to stop it from being such a huge negative, faster paths to citizenship, looser requirements for switching jobs, higher minimum salaries. All these things would improve conditions for the H1-B applicant. That's why I call it a bad program.
- emodendroket 12d ago
  Put another way I don’t think this policy is a good way to address the issues you’re talking about because it’s just moving jobs out of the U.S. altogether.
  - chuckadams 12d ago
    Jobs that Americans weren't getting because it was cheaper to hire an H1-B indentured servant instead. The current administration will no doubt find a way to make everything worse, but they didn't start with a good program to begin with.
    - emodendroket 12d ago
      Just because the status quo isn’t good doesn’t mean we should blindly support anyone changing it even if their results will be even worse.
      - chuckadams 12d ago
        I think I'm more likely to become a nun than blindly support anything from the current administration.
        emodendroket 12d ago
        Well I’m not sure you will find many people who feel the program is perfect as-is but the natural interpretation of what you said in context seemed to be that we should at least temper our criticism.

BeetleB 12d ago

> What I do care about is the fact that H1-B locks immigrants to a company They're free to change companies if the new company sponsors them. It may reset the timeline for applying for a green card, depending on the location and job type of the new job. Generally, if it's the same type of job in the same city, it doesn't reset. People (including Indians) do it all the time. Going to a country for employment and having your legal status tied to a company is pretty standard across the world. Do you know counterexamples?

dominotw 12d ago
> Going to a country for employment and having your legal status tied to a company is pretty standard across the world. Do you know counterexamples? TN visa
- BeetleB 12d ago
  By counterexamples, I meant other countries where you get in via an employment visa and don't have your presence tied to the employer. TN visa is much more restrictive than H1B. Only for citizens of two countries, and only for certain professions. I know Canadians who have no hope of getting a TN visa (wrong profession), but have come on H1B.
  - dominotw 12d ago
    Its an example right? now you are shifting goalposts to be easily available to everyone or something.
    - BeetleB 12d ago
      I guess I wasn't being clear. The original comment I was responding to was: > What I do care about is the fact that H-1B locks immigrants to a company and tie their residence in the us to their employment. I am merely pointing out that most countries lock employment visas to the employer. It's fine not to like it, but I'm highlighting that this is pretty normal - the US is not an outlier.