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Quoting from the official website: >>>>>> The new procedure targets inappropriate behavior by parents and spectators directed at children, coaching staff memb

by qsort 20d ago

Quoting from the official website: >>>>>> The new procedure targets inappropriate behavior by parents and spectators directed at children, coaching staff members, referees, match officials, or other parents and spectators. This includes, but is not limited to: Verbal abuse (insults or profanity), as well as physical assault or shoving of one’s own children; Verbal abuse, physical assault, or shoving of staff members of one’s own team; Verbal abuse, physical assault, or shoving of players or staff members of the opposing team; Continuous challenging, verbal abuse, physical assault, or shoving of referees and match officials; Verbal or physical altercations with other parents or spectators. <<<<<< If that's the situation in, and it can't be stressed enough, a children soccer game, then yes, abandoning the match is probably the right choice. I assume they are only defining a formal procedure for practices that already exist.

Loughla 20d ago
>If that's the situation in, and it can't be stressed enough, a children soccer game It's not extremely common in my area, but it is more common than you would think. Parents treat their children like lottery tickets when it comes to athletics. And God help you if you're the unfortunate umpire at a travel league game that makes a questionable call. The youth sports industry is fucking gross and nobody seems to notice. Source: we will not let our children participate in travel leagues and they do not want to participate in them either, for this specific reason.
- steveBK123 20d ago
  I umpired baseball in my early teens and even 30 years ago it was bad. Grown men getting into the face of 14 years old umpires over calls, at games for kids barely out of tee-ball. It just doesn’t matter that much. I remember a coach who would flip over 20 gallon coolers and send ice and drinks flying in the dugout.. in front of his team of 10 years old umpires olds.
  - chneu 20d ago
    I officiated basketball, baseball, softball and volleyball about 15-20 years ago on the west coast. It was bad then. So many drunk parents in baseball. I tossed parents from basketball games for cussing at their kids. Volleyball was pretty chill tho.
    - dylan604 19d ago
      In Texas, there's an association, TASO, that is in charge of referees for all sports. There is no requirement about having experience in officiating at all. You attend a few meetings, pay the fees, and start officiating. The crazy thing is that once a TASO member, you can move from sport to sport. It's easy to see officials that are definitely out of their depth. As a player, it is insulting that they can't play their sport because the one in charge of the match is not very good. As parent, it's aggravating because their kid and teammates are getting boned. After personally experiencing the literal "inside baseball" of Texas high school officiating, they bring some of the flak on their officials in their attitude on who can be an official. I knew people that just slid from one sport to the next based on season as a source of a fairly decent income. Volleyball refs just sit in a chair, so physical fitness doesn't really limit how good of an official they can be. Soccer refs on the other hand...
      - FireBeyond 19d ago
        That's the association's problem, not the referees. When I refereed basketball in Australia, referee grading was done according to FIBA standards and you had to be evaluated before any promotion in your referee grade and that could be (at the lowest levels) 3 games on 3 occasions through to 10 games or more. And when we got to a certain (albeit relatively high) level, we'd have every game recorded and reviewed.
        dylan604 19d ago
        No disagreement, which is why I said that the association is to blame. If a ref isn't good enough yet they still continue to be assigned games, then the org allowing that to happen is at fault. The immediate response is that they don't have enough officials to to start sitting officials based on performance/ability. That's just further indictment to me, but "it's just a kid's game" blah blah.
  - LanceH 19d ago
    Baseball in particular has a problem with anger is the arguments. Like there is no argument without a hostile tone. Players/managers never seem to merely appeal a call -- they jump straight to harsh yelling. Compare it to soccer where there is also a lot of whininess in the complaining about calls. It's become accepted that vulgar, angry, disagreement is acceptable until it goes "too far". Tantrums are just socially accepted in baseball, and some other sports.
    - happymellon 19d ago
      This is one of the reasons I like rugby. Probably being born from public schools, and teachers being the referees, they don't have to take any nonsense from players and can take the ball away from you, lose you ground you have gained, or card you if are abusive to the referee. Abusive parents on the sidelines can result in sanctions on clubs. Even if you think the referee made a bad call, it is never acceptable to be abusive to match officials. It blows my mind the things I see in football they allow people to get away with.
      - LanceH 19d ago
        I love how in rugby if two guys are going a little two hard at each other the referee will call them over along with their captains, and address the captains while these gigantic players stand there like children. One other offshoot of rugby officiating is they will admit wrongs and they'll say things like "I didn't see that." Compare that to the NFL where the refs make a bad call and the league will back them up to the point of being ridiculous by reinterpreting the rules to make the officials right (see "not a catch"). Rugby is so refreshing.
- verve_rat 20d ago
  >youth sports industry Yup, well there's your problem.
- dylan604 19d ago
  I spent several years as a soccer ref including high school matches. It never failed that every time I hit my whistle, the side of the stadium opposite of the direction of me signaling the foul would always erupt in jeers. You could always tell the helicopter parents complaining about non-calls not appreciating that soccer is a contact sport. There was only one game where the officiating crew was escorted by police, but I really felt that was over blowing the situation. There was the one game were we had to temporarily suspend the match because of gunfire in the area not aimed at the pitch, but uncomfortably close. The funny thing is, I became a ref because I was giving the ref of one of the games I was on the touchline coaching wasn't abusive, but definitely a constant barrage of second guessing. At the end of the match, one of the association members suggest that if I didn't like the level of refereeing that I should become a ref myself. I accepted the Pepsi challenge that rest of history. My favorite experience was a coach that was getting a bit grating. I remembered a line an old timer mentioned that I decided to give a try, "hey coach! you got an assistant? you better get 'em warmed up!" As a coach, the absolute worst part of the 10 year experience absolutely was the parents. Luckily, I never had abusive parts. It was always over excited cheering for the dumbest things from people that had no clue about tactics and thinking that blindly booting the ball up the pitch was awesome. We had no player with the speed or skill of going over the top route one, so it was just a dumb play. Usually, by the end of the season some of the other parents could usually get them calmed down. It also helped to remind some of the over the top parents that this was recreational play, and everyone got the same t-shirt at the end of the season. Nobody was getting scholarships. It was basically bragging rights for the kids back at school.
  - kamarg 19d ago
    As teens my brother and I both refed youth soccer. The parents were the absolute worst part of the experience. One of them actually followed my brother back to his car after a game to yell at him more. It was so bad that the ref association took the guy to what I've always called "soccer court" (not sure what it actually was) to have him banned from coming back for the rest of the season. That was a U-12 girls rec game by the way.
    - dylan604 19d ago
- FireBeyond 19d ago
  Absolutely - I used to referee basketball in Australia, including at a high level. Extremely high level junior, was generally not an issue. As was true local league. It was the intermediates, the travel leagues. Where "your kid is good but is still not going to be a pro" (the NBA sends a letter to all new D1 college players congratulating them on the effort they've put in to get this far - and to focus on their education, as the NBA drafts <1% of D1 college players, let alone anybody else). Those were the ones where the parents were convinced that their kid was going to be a pro and the only thing holding him back was "that fucking referee". We had the power to eject those parents from the venue. Which was usually a conversation that went something like this: Ref: You need to leave the venue until the end of the game. Parent: It's my fucking kid's game and I'm not leaving and you can't fucking make me. Ref: You're right, I can't remove you from the venue. I can however forfeit the game on your child's behalf. Kid: Daaaad. [usually weary as this tends not to happen just the once]. Go and wait in the car. Pleaseeeee. Parent: I will go and wait in the car, and we're going to wait and when you come out, you and I are going to fucking get into it, ref. Cue security, if not police, walking refs to their cars.
bawolff 20d ago
..physical assault or shoving of one’s own children damn. I feel like ideally the police or CPS should be called. Forfeiting the game seems like a mild consequence.
4b11b4 19d ago
Yeah if I had a parent doing that I'd fucking tell to em go sit in the car otherwise this game's over

by qsort 20d ago

Loughla 20d ago

>If that's the situation in, and it can't be stressed enough, a children soccer game It's not extremely common in my area, but it is more common than you would think. Parents treat their children like lottery tickets when it comes to athletics. And God help you if you're the unfortunate umpire at a travel league game that makes a questionable call. The youth sports industry is fucking gross and nobody seems to notice. Source: we will not let our children participate in travel leagues and they do not want to participate in them either, for this specific reason.

steveBK123 20d ago
I umpired baseball in my early teens and even 30 years ago it was bad. Grown men getting into the face of 14 years old umpires over calls, at games for kids barely out of tee-ball. It just doesn’t matter that much. I remember a coach who would flip over 20 gallon coolers and send ice and drinks flying in the dugout.. in front of his team of 10 years old umpires olds.
- chneu 20d ago
  I officiated basketball, baseball, softball and volleyball about 15-20 years ago on the west coast. It was bad then. So many drunk parents in baseball. I tossed parents from basketball games for cussing at their kids. Volleyball was pretty chill tho.
  - dylan604 19d ago
    In Texas, there's an association, TASO, that is in charge of referees for all sports. There is no requirement about having experience in officiating at all. You attend a few meetings, pay the fees, and start officiating. The crazy thing is that once a TASO member, you can move from sport to sport. It's easy to see officials that are definitely out of their depth. As a player, it is insulting that they can't play their sport because the one in charge of the match is not very good. As parent, it's aggravating because their kid and teammates are getting boned. After personally experiencing the literal "inside baseball" of Texas high school officiating, they bring some of the flak on their officials in their attitude on who can be an official. I knew people that just slid from one sport to the next based on season as a source of a fairly decent income. Volleyball refs just sit in a chair, so physical fitness doesn't really limit how good of an official they can be. Soccer refs on the other hand...
    - FireBeyond 19d ago
      That's the association's problem, not the referees. When I refereed basketball in Australia, referee grading was done according to FIBA standards and you had to be evaluated before any promotion in your referee grade and that could be (at the lowest levels) 3 games on 3 occasions through to 10 games or more. And when we got to a certain (albeit relatively high) level, we'd have every game recorded and reviewed.
      - dylan604 19d ago
        No disagreement, which is why I said that the association is to blame. If a ref isn't good enough yet they still continue to be assigned games, then the org allowing that to happen is at fault. The immediate response is that they don't have enough officials to to start sitting officials based on performance/ability. That's just further indictment to me, but "it's just a kid's game" blah blah.
- LanceH 19d ago
  Baseball in particular has a problem with anger is the arguments. Like there is no argument without a hostile tone. Players/managers never seem to merely appeal a call -- they jump straight to harsh yelling. Compare it to soccer where there is also a lot of whininess in the complaining about calls. It's become accepted that vulgar, angry, disagreement is acceptable until it goes "too far". Tantrums are just socially accepted in baseball, and some other sports.
  - happymellon 19d ago
    This is one of the reasons I like rugby. Probably being born from public schools, and teachers being the referees, they don't have to take any nonsense from players and can take the ball away from you, lose you ground you have gained, or card you if are abusive to the referee. Abusive parents on the sidelines can result in sanctions on clubs. Even if you think the referee made a bad call, it is never acceptable to be abusive to match officials. It blows my mind the things I see in football they allow people to get away with.
    - LanceH 19d ago
      I love how in rugby if two guys are going a little two hard at each other the referee will call them over along with their captains, and address the captains while these gigantic players stand there like children. One other offshoot of rugby officiating is they will admit wrongs and they'll say things like "I didn't see that." Compare that to the NFL where the refs make a bad call and the league will back them up to the point of being ridiculous by reinterpreting the rules to make the officials right (see "not a catch"). Rugby is so refreshing.
verve_rat 20d ago
>youth sports industry Yup, well there's your problem.
dylan604 19d ago
I spent several years as a soccer ref including high school matches. It never failed that every time I hit my whistle, the side of the stadium opposite of the direction of me signaling the foul would always erupt in jeers. You could always tell the helicopter parents complaining about non-calls not appreciating that soccer is a contact sport. There was only one game where the officiating crew was escorted by police, but I really felt that was over blowing the situation. There was the one game were we had to temporarily suspend the match because of gunfire in the area not aimed at the pitch, but uncomfortably close. The funny thing is, I became a ref because I was giving the ref of one of the games I was on the touchline coaching wasn't abusive, but definitely a constant barrage of second guessing. At the end of the match, one of the association members suggest that if I didn't like the level of refereeing that I should become a ref myself. I accepted the Pepsi challenge that rest of history. My favorite experience was a coach that was getting a bit grating. I remembered a line an old timer mentioned that I decided to give a try, "hey coach! you got an assistant? you better get 'em warmed up!" As a coach, the absolute worst part of the 10 year experience absolutely was the parents. Luckily, I never had abusive parts. It was always over excited cheering for the dumbest things from people that had no clue about tactics and thinking that blindly booting the ball up the pitch was awesome. We had no player with the speed or skill of going over the top route one, so it was just a dumb play. Usually, by the end of the season some of the other parents could usually get them calmed down. It also helped to remind some of the over the top parents that this was recreational play, and everyone got the same t-shirt at the end of the season. Nobody was getting scholarships. It was basically bragging rights for the kids back at school.
- kamarg 19d ago
  As teens my brother and I both refed youth soccer. The parents were the absolute worst part of the experience. One of them actually followed my brother back to his car after a game to yell at him more. It was so bad that the ref association took the guy to what I've always called "soccer court" (not sure what it actually was) to have him banned from coming back for the rest of the season. That was a U-12 girls rec game by the way.
  - dylan604 19d ago
FireBeyond 19d ago
Absolutely - I used to referee basketball in Australia, including at a high level. Extremely high level junior, was generally not an issue. As was true local league. It was the intermediates, the travel leagues. Where "your kid is good but is still not going to be a pro" (the NBA sends a letter to all new D1 college players congratulating them on the effort they've put in to get this far - and to focus on their education, as the NBA drafts <1% of D1 college players, let alone anybody else). Those were the ones where the parents were convinced that their kid was going to be a pro and the only thing holding him back was "that fucking referee". We had the power to eject those parents from the venue. Which was usually a conversation that went something like this: Ref: You need to leave the venue until the end of the game. Parent: It's my fucking kid's game and I'm not leaving and you can't fucking make me. Ref: You're right, I can't remove you from the venue. I can however forfeit the game on your child's behalf. Kid: Daaaad. [usually weary as this tends not to happen just the once]. Go and wait in the car. Pleaseeeee. Parent: I will go and wait in the car, and we're going to wait and when you come out, you and I are going to fucking get into it, ref. Cue security, if not police, walking refs to their cars.

bawolff 20d ago

..physical assault or shoving of one’s own children damn. I feel like ideally the police or CPS should be called. Forfeiting the game seems like a mild consequence.

4b11b4 19d ago

Yeah if I had a parent doing that I'd fucking tell to em go sit in the car otherwise this game's over