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I must have been unclear. My point is 3. I, and they (they said that AI would devalue their skills) think that their jobs are going to be decimated by AI. The

by pingou 22d ago

I must have been unclear. My point is 3. I, and they (they said that AI would devalue their skills) think that their jobs are going to be decimated by AI. They can stop AI in the US, but how are they gonna prevent China from making their jobs redundant with AI? Even if they put enormous tariffs on China, they would still lose all business outside of the US. In the best scenario, after some recession they could stagnate if they stay isolated while productivity in the rest of the world explodes. >It's also really odd that you think they'll get anything in return. What makes you think this? Has this ever happened in the past, in the US, when too-big-too-fail companies laid off all their staff? This unwarranted optimism is the stuff of science fiction. Don't you see the long term trend in every society to increase public spending to support their population more and more over the last 100 years? I do not think it is in the interest of the AI overlords to have a revolution, but of course there are reasons to be fearful. Yet again, stopping AI in the US will not stop AI in the rest of the world, there is an arm race going on, one that seems almost impossible to stop, unfortunately. There are very good reasons to call for more regulations and prevent data centers from being built too close to residential areas, or not using renewables, or plenty of other reasons. But being opposed to every data center because you are afraid for your job seems like a mistake to me. Unless you can prevent all of the world from using AI, in that case yes, it does make sense, I just think it is impossible.

lelanthran 22d ago
> I must have been unclear. My point is 3. Okay, in that case you're still being irrational and illogical, expecting people to go to the slaughterhouse quietly. Of course they are going to protest. Whether it makes a difference because some competitor on the other side of the globe could theoretically do the same thing is irrelevant - people on the way to the slaughterhouse will not go quietly.
- pingou 21d ago
  Oh it is understandable that they are pissed and protesting, I'm not surprised they do, nothing is illogical there when you know human nature and people emotional state. I'd be pissed too. I am pissed too, as a programmer that has his job done more and more by AI. However it seems to me that you are the illogical one, or perhaps we are having a different conversation, you talking about their feelings, and me talking about the consequences of their choices. There are two choices, go to the slaughterhouse (probably losing your job due to inability to compete internationally and getting nothing in return), or take the different option, which is less bad, and might even be good (probably losing your job and potentially getting money without even working). Isn't it illogical to choose the slaughterhouse?
  - lelanthran 21d ago
    > There are two choices, go to the slaughterhouse (probably losing your job due to inability to compete internationally and getting nothing in return), or take the different option, which is less bad, and might even be good (probably losing your job and potentially getting money without even working). In both choices they are getting nothing in return, nor have they even been promised anything in return. I mean, if they had been promised something in return, I can understand your PoV, but there are no promises that going to the slaughterhouse for the local companies gets them something in return.
    - pingou 21d ago
      Indeed nobody has promised them anything, but it seems obvious to me that it's better that the technology that is gonna take your job is controlled by your own country rather than by another country, one that isn't even particularly friendly to you. I don't think there are a lot of countries that are happy that they are not the US nor China so that they don't have to deal with AI. Some of their population perhaps is, for now. But most would love to be able to catch up.

by pingou 22d ago

lelanthran 22d ago

> I must have been unclear. My point is 3. Okay, in that case you're still being irrational and illogical, expecting people to go to the slaughterhouse quietly. Of course they are going to protest. Whether it makes a difference because some competitor on the other side of the globe could theoretically do the same thing is irrelevant - people on the way to the slaughterhouse will not go quietly.

pingou 21d ago
Oh it is understandable that they are pissed and protesting, I'm not surprised they do, nothing is illogical there when you know human nature and people emotional state. I'd be pissed too. I am pissed too, as a programmer that has his job done more and more by AI. However it seems to me that you are the illogical one, or perhaps we are having a different conversation, you talking about their feelings, and me talking about the consequences of their choices. There are two choices, go to the slaughterhouse (probably losing your job due to inability to compete internationally and getting nothing in return), or take the different option, which is less bad, and might even be good (probably losing your job and potentially getting money without even working). Isn't it illogical to choose the slaughterhouse?
- lelanthran 21d ago
  > There are two choices, go to the slaughterhouse (probably losing your job due to inability to compete internationally and getting nothing in return), or take the different option, which is less bad, and might even be good (probably losing your job and potentially getting money without even working). In both choices they are getting nothing in return, nor have they even been promised anything in return. I mean, if they had been promised something in return, I can understand your PoV, but there are no promises that going to the slaughterhouse for the local companies gets them something in return.
  - pingou 21d ago
    Indeed nobody has promised them anything, but it seems obvious to me that it's better that the technology that is gonna take your job is controlled by your own country rather than by another country, one that isn't even particularly friendly to you. I don't think there are a lot of countries that are happy that they are not the US nor China so that they don't have to deal with AI. Some of their population perhaps is, for now. But most would love to be able to catch up.