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Alas, in my country WhatsApp is obligatory. Everyone uses it, businesses and banks included, and no one, at all, uses SMS. Most don't even know what SMS is for,

Alas, in my country WhatsApp is obligatory. Everyone uses it, businesses and banks included, and no one, at all, uses SMS. Most don't even know what SMS is for, all they know is they get random spam by their ISP, and sometimes 2FA bubbles, on an app called "Messages", but that's it. Now, technically it's possible to go without it, but life becomes so much harder it just isn't worth the hassle.

alex1138 24d ago
You know why? Because Acton and Koum arranged the carrier deals prior to the acquisition. That's what Zuckerberg bought, to enlargen his war chest. It's not his product, it's something he effectively stole
- alexgieg 24d ago
  True, but here things went a little differently. Carriers here charged per SMS sent, and had plans with things like "includes 100 messages per month for free!!!" and extra SMS packages sold at a discount compared to the standard price, even years after they had began providing Internet (2G at the time). People sought cheaper alternatives, and for a while several messaging apps were used, but WhatsApp was so convenient compared to everyone else (using the phone number as username, no password required, was a genius move), that it was already becoming the standard before Facebook came and acquired it. Carriers noticed their error eventually, and stopped charging for SMS, but by then it was too late. They even tried using the tribunals to block WhatsApp, without success, and technical measures to degrade WhatsApp's protocol and block audio and video calls on it, which also failed legally. So they eventually relented, and now offer packages like "n GB/month plus free WhatsApp!!!" (and in small letters: "audio and video calls not included").
  - pjc50 24d ago
    Yeah, I think people forget that before the internet there was the telcos. They had a "microtransaction" infrastructure, and they were determined to use it by gatekeeping everything. The power of the internet making almost everything almost free has been hugely net positive, although not without a few downsides.
- tao_oat 24d ago
  > effectively stole Could you say more about this? I'm not very familiar with the WhatsApp acquisition, or necessarily happy about it, but at first glance I don't see what part would come anywhere close to theft.
  - iso1631 24d ago
    Zuck paid billions to buy it. It almost all collapsed because of an airmiles ticket which couldn't be changed.
    - alex1138 23d ago
      Ok, I have not heard about the airmiles ticket; elaborate?
      - iso1631 23d ago
        https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/952359-thoughts-about-my-free-iphone-app-whatsapp-5.html#post22387891 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/952359-tho...
    - tao_oat 23d ago
      Sure, but I fail to see where the theft comes in.
lenkite 24d ago
Same - WhatsApp has become mandatory in many nations like India even though I despise it with a passion. I wish the United Nations made a resolution to standardize messaging protocols and develop open-source common messaging libraries with no data given to advertisers.
- alexgieg 22d ago
  The UN kinda already did. The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) is part of the UN. Its ITU-T H.350 recommendations include a famous one for instant messaging: XMPP. It's not only encrypted but also fully decentralized. Which is why it hasn't been adopted. Everyone with any power, from governments to telcos to big enterprises, prefers centralized services. Hence SMS, its upgrade, RCS, and the many private protocols.

alex1138 24d ago

You know why? Because Acton and Koum arranged the carrier deals prior to the acquisition. That's what Zuckerberg bought, to enlargen his war chest. It's not his product, it's something he effectively stole

alexgieg 24d ago
True, but here things went a little differently. Carriers here charged per SMS sent, and had plans with things like "includes 100 messages per month for free!!!" and extra SMS packages sold at a discount compared to the standard price, even years after they had began providing Internet (2G at the time). People sought cheaper alternatives, and for a while several messaging apps were used, but WhatsApp was so convenient compared to everyone else (using the phone number as username, no password required, was a genius move), that it was already becoming the standard before Facebook came and acquired it. Carriers noticed their error eventually, and stopped charging for SMS, but by then it was too late. They even tried using the tribunals to block WhatsApp, without success, and technical measures to degrade WhatsApp's protocol and block audio and video calls on it, which also failed legally. So they eventually relented, and now offer packages like "n GB/month plus free WhatsApp!!!" (and in small letters: "audio and video calls not included").
- pjc50 24d ago
  Yeah, I think people forget that before the internet there was the telcos. They had a "microtransaction" infrastructure, and they were determined to use it by gatekeeping everything. The power of the internet making almost everything almost free has been hugely net positive, although not without a few downsides.
tao_oat 24d ago
> effectively stole Could you say more about this? I'm not very familiar with the WhatsApp acquisition, or necessarily happy about it, but at first glance I don't see what part would come anywhere close to theft.
- iso1631 24d ago
  Zuck paid billions to buy it. It almost all collapsed because of an airmiles ticket which couldn't be changed.
  - alex1138 23d ago
    Ok, I have not heard about the airmiles ticket; elaborate?
    - iso1631 23d ago
      https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/952359-thoughts-about-my-free-iphone-app-whatsapp-5.html#post22387891 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-technology/952359-tho...
  - tao_oat 23d ago
    Sure, but I fail to see where the theft comes in.

lenkite 24d ago

Same - WhatsApp has become mandatory in many nations like India even though I despise it with a passion. I wish the United Nations made a resolution to standardize messaging protocols and develop open-source common messaging libraries with no data given to advertisers.

alexgieg 22d ago
The UN kinda already did. The International Telecommunication Union (ITU) is part of the UN. Its ITU-T H.350 recommendations include a famous one for instant messaging: XMPP. It's not only encrypted but also fully decentralized. Which is why it hasn't been adopted. Everyone with any power, from governments to telcos to big enterprises, prefers centralized services. Hence SMS, its upgrade, RCS, and the many private protocols.