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It is a rather surprising state of affairs that this is something that is not apparent to you. Why do you think I have to say the following; giving your child o

It is a rather surprising state of affairs that this is something that is not apparent to you. Why do you think I have to say the following; giving your child over to an absolute stranger to spend more waking/disposable time with that you, the parent, is NOT a good thing... neither in daycare or even school. Yes, it's easy for me to say and the system is very much set up to facilitate extraction of profit from the neo-slave professional class while fostering their procreation to rear the next generation of neo-slave professionals; but we really need to break free of this spell that government (i.e., the ruling class' apparatchiks) do not have your child or even your won best interest in mind. Ironically, if we do get "investment in mothers" and "universal childcare", it will be for the profit and benefit of the ruling class that will want to make sure your child is indoctrinated in the regime's propaganda as early and deeply as possible and the youngest age possible, especially since the telescreen, aka, TV has fragmented so much and kids are seeing things like genocide being committed and by whom and they aren't hardened adults yet that can look the other way in order to keep their neo-slave "job" that gets them shiny stuff.

gumby 23d ago
> Ironically, if we do get "investment in mothers" and "universal childcare", it will be for the profit and benefit of the ruling class that will want to make sure your child is indoctrinated in the regime's propaganda as early and deeply as possible This feels over the top/paranoid to me. But I also acknowledge that East Germany’s universal child care was dismantled after German unification for being exactly what you describe.
- OkayPhysicist 23d ago
  That's not why East Germany's universal child care was dismantled at all. East Germany's universal child care was dismantled after unification because West Germany didn't want to pay for it, and former East Germany couldn't. It was one of the most popular programs East Germany had, and was a source of quite a bit of consternation when it was taken away.
  - gumby 22d ago
    I was in Germany in those days and I sure remember the CDU and other more-right wingers using this argument, and convincingly. I’m sure there’s some long and worthy essay on the topic in the archives of die Zeit. Of course it was long ago now.
lotsofpulp 23d ago
All of human history, children grew up spending lots of time under the supervision of older siblings, cousins, and other elders in the “village”. Mothers (and fathers) had to be out getting water, foraging, hunting, doing laundry, farming, blah blah. Obviously there is a middle ground between parents leaving kids for 10 hours straight and only seeing them 2 hours per day, but spending all day with parents and no one else is also another extreme (I would have gone nuts watching over them all day). All these government actions don’t have an answer to the loss of the “village” that are inherent to economic mobility, having fewer children per family, and neighborhoods optimized for cars.
- watwut 23d ago
  They spent a lot of time just being entirely unsupervised, cause adulta had other duties.
  - lotsofpulp 23d ago
    If we are discussing 1 to 5 year olds, I doubt they spent a lot of time unsupervised. At the least a chain of older kids was probably around them.
    - purpleflame1257 23d ago
      There were literally toddlers walking into the fire they were so unattrnded
    - watwut 23d ago
      5 years old were unsupervised in my grandma generation. 1-4 years old were pervised by 10 years old. Not sure how that counts.
UncleMeat 23d ago
I am a father. I am an extremely involved parent and spend a ton of time with my son. I also would go absolutely insane if we didn't have any childcare for him. It is better for my ability to function as a good parent that I can hand him off to somebody else for a period of time. It is not the case that every couple has a member who is built to be a stay-at-home-parent.

gumby 23d ago

> Ironically, if we do get "investment in mothers" and "universal childcare", it will be for the profit and benefit of the ruling class that will want to make sure your child is indoctrinated in the regime's propaganda as early and deeply as possible This feels over the top/paranoid to me. But I also acknowledge that East Germany’s universal child care was dismantled after German unification for being exactly what you describe.

OkayPhysicist 23d ago
That's not why East Germany's universal child care was dismantled at all. East Germany's universal child care was dismantled after unification because West Germany didn't want to pay for it, and former East Germany couldn't. It was one of the most popular programs East Germany had, and was a source of quite a bit of consternation when it was taken away.
- gumby 22d ago
  I was in Germany in those days and I sure remember the CDU and other more-right wingers using this argument, and convincingly. I’m sure there’s some long and worthy essay on the topic in the archives of die Zeit. Of course it was long ago now.

lotsofpulp 23d ago

All of human history, children grew up spending lots of time under the supervision of older siblings, cousins, and other elders in the “village”. Mothers (and fathers) had to be out getting water, foraging, hunting, doing laundry, farming, blah blah. Obviously there is a middle ground between parents leaving kids for 10 hours straight and only seeing them 2 hours per day, but spending all day with parents and no one else is also another extreme (I would have gone nuts watching over them all day). All these government actions don’t have an answer to the loss of the “village” that are inherent to economic mobility, having fewer children per family, and neighborhoods optimized for cars.

watwut 23d ago
They spent a lot of time just being entirely unsupervised, cause adulta had other duties.
- lotsofpulp 23d ago
  If we are discussing 1 to 5 year olds, I doubt they spent a lot of time unsupervised. At the least a chain of older kids was probably around them.
  - purpleflame1257 23d ago
    There were literally toddlers walking into the fire they were so unattrnded
  - watwut 23d ago
    5 years old were unsupervised in my grandma generation. 1-4 years old were pervised by 10 years old. Not sure how that counts.

UncleMeat 23d ago

I am a father. I am an extremely involved parent and spend a ton of time with my son. I also would go absolutely insane if we didn't have any childcare for him. It is better for my ability to function as a good parent that I can hand him off to somebody else for a period of time. It is not the case that every couple has a member who is built to be a stay-at-home-parent.