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See how in your own link one of the authors says indeed how the decline in results is because we have gone too woke: Dworak, a research assistant professor a

See how in your own link one of the authors says indeed how the decline in results is because we have gone too woke: Dworak, a research assistant professor at Northwestern University and one of the authors on the study, is very clear that these results don’t necessarily mean Americans are getting less intelligent. “It doesn’t mean their mental ability is lower or higher; it’s just a difference in scores that are favoring older or newer samples,” she said in a press release. “It could just be that they’re getting worse at taking tests or specifically worse at taking these kinds of tests.” And, it should be said, there has long been debate over how accurately IQ tests are able to gauge overall intelligence and potential for success in society in the first place. No wait, they say nothing of the kind. And it seems people are getting better at 3D-thinking and decline is not the same in every topic measured so… Man, your referencecreally does not support the narrative to which you are trying to bend the reality.

somenameforme 26d ago
You're reading into things as you want to read into them. I am saying that the rejection of reality, which includes but is certainly not limited to 'woke', is the problem. IQ is full of examples in this domain because it tends to provide measurable data that regularly contradicts ideological views. I think the author's own response is a perfect example. She finds that people are scoring significantly worse on most measurable aspects of IQ and so she concludes that they may simply be getting worse at taking tests? Let's imagine in a parallel world (or China...) she did the same study and found that scores were increasing. Would she have suggested it may simply be because people are getting better at taking tests? Almost certainly not, because it's a highly improbable explanation with no foundational basis whatsoever. If you don't think the tests you're using to evaluate something are evaluating that thing, then why would you use those tests? So why would she make the claim in one scenario, but not the other? Because of ideology. We obviously want IQs to be going up, and so the ideological value is given at least equal weighting, if not more, against the significantly more probable 'natural' explanation when the 'natural' explanation goes against ideological desires.
- delis-thumbs-7e 25d ago
  No, I think it is you who are really jumping into conclusions while being extremely obtuse what those are. Essentially you are basing your claims on research the conductor of you don’t trust. So you trust the data to be certain, but not the conclusions the researchers make of that data, why? Because they warn of jumping to exactly the kind of conclusions you are making. What is the ideological view this data contradicts and presumably the researcher has? But you are certain that the researcher has some ideology and you know what it is? Besides, that survey was a personality test and labelled as one, so the partakets might simply not have been interested in concentrating on the IQ part: Another factor could be due to a decline in motivation, Dworak said. Because the SAPA Project is advertised as a personality survey, individuals seeking out the test may be more engaged with sections related to measuring temperament and less engaged with sections that are seemingly unrelated to personality.
  - somenameforme 25d ago
    Data are meaningful, but interpretations without a mathematical or scientific foundation are worthless. And her own explanations are particularly useless as they demonstrate clear ex post facto reasoning. The study was preregistered and chose a specific measurement as a source of IQ. After finding an undesired result, her rhetoric is now that her chosen measurement does, or may not, measure IQ. In one way she should be applauded for obviously not HARKing, but on the other hand that's essentially exactly what she's now trying to do. Furthermore, reverse Flynn Effects have been demonstrated unambiguously in most of every Western/OECD nation where measuring such has been attempted. So the US also suffering such is 100% expected. There is simply no logical, scientific, mathematical, or even rational support for her argument. What's left after you remove everything reasonable? Ideology. ---- Basically I think this is a perfect example of the problem. The most logical explanation here, by an overwhelmingly wide margin, is that people are becoming less intelligent, so far as IQ can measure. That's a huge concern and something that should be tackled immediately. Instead what are we doing? Ideologically motivated denialism. If China had similar results and saw their IQs were decreasing, they're not going to just go 'nah, we're just getting worse at taking tests - or something.' They'd be taking this very seriously, and that sort of focus on reality is why they are now starting to take over just about everything while Western outcomes continue plummeting.

somenameforme 26d ago

You're reading into things as you want to read into them. I am saying that the rejection of reality, which includes but is certainly not limited to 'woke', is the problem. IQ is full of examples in this domain because it tends to provide measurable data that regularly contradicts ideological views. I think the author's own response is a perfect example. She finds that people are scoring significantly worse on most measurable aspects of IQ and so she concludes that they may simply be getting worse at taking tests? Let's imagine in a parallel world (or China...) she did the same study and found that scores were increasing. Would she have suggested it may simply be because people are getting better at taking tests? Almost certainly not, because it's a highly improbable explanation with no foundational basis whatsoever. If you don't think the tests you're using to evaluate something are evaluating that thing, then why would you use those tests? So why would she make the claim in one scenario, but not the other? Because of ideology. We obviously want IQs to be going up, and so the ideological value is given at least equal weighting, if not more, against the significantly more probable 'natural' explanation when the 'natural' explanation goes against ideological desires.

delis-thumbs-7e 25d ago
No, I think it is you who are really jumping into conclusions while being extremely obtuse what those are. Essentially you are basing your claims on research the conductor of you don’t trust. So you trust the data to be certain, but not the conclusions the researchers make of that data, why? Because they warn of jumping to exactly the kind of conclusions you are making. What is the ideological view this data contradicts and presumably the researcher has? But you are certain that the researcher has some ideology and you know what it is? Besides, that survey was a personality test and labelled as one, so the partakets might simply not have been interested in concentrating on the IQ part: Another factor could be due to a decline in motivation, Dworak said. Because the SAPA Project is advertised as a personality survey, individuals seeking out the test may be more engaged with sections related to measuring temperament and less engaged with sections that are seemingly unrelated to personality.
- somenameforme 25d ago
  Data are meaningful, but interpretations without a mathematical or scientific foundation are worthless. And her own explanations are particularly useless as they demonstrate clear ex post facto reasoning. The study was preregistered and chose a specific measurement as a source of IQ. After finding an undesired result, her rhetoric is now that her chosen measurement does, or may not, measure IQ. In one way she should be applauded for obviously not HARKing, but on the other hand that's essentially exactly what she's now trying to do. Furthermore, reverse Flynn Effects have been demonstrated unambiguously in most of every Western/OECD nation where measuring such has been attempted. So the US also suffering such is 100% expected. There is simply no logical, scientific, mathematical, or even rational support for her argument. What's left after you remove everything reasonable? Ideology. ---- Basically I think this is a perfect example of the problem. The most logical explanation here, by an overwhelmingly wide margin, is that people are becoming less intelligent, so far as IQ can measure. That's a huge concern and something that should be tackled immediately. Instead what are we doing? Ideologically motivated denialism. If China had similar results and saw their IQs were decreasing, they're not going to just go 'nah, we're just getting worse at taking tests - or something.' They'd be taking this very seriously, and that sort of focus on reality is why they are now starting to take over just about everything while Western outcomes continue plummeting.