4 ms·

Respect for the consumer has long been gone generally except for a few brands. I am still wondering why consumer respecting brands are not emerging more and th

by Anoian 27d ago

Respect for the consumer has long been gone generally except for a few brands. I am still wondering why consumer respecting brands are not emerging more and thriving.

usern20260720 27d ago
A consumer respecting brand sells products. A Consumer selling brand sells consumers so they can be profiled, analysed for weaknesses and exploited economically in the name of Surveillance Capitalism
DarkUranium 27d ago
I suspect because it's hard to differentiate between ones that actually respect the consumer vs ones that only say so, but are actually lying to your face. That and not respecting the consumer is more profitable in the short term (only!), which means more marketing money, buying out other brands, lobbying to increase the barrier for entry, et cetera.
fithisux 27d ago
That is why politicians get rich. But also, people do not generally hesitate in front of an all-you-can-eat bouffe
ngcazz 27d ago
Because there's no incentive to do it. The consequences of being tracked are outta sight outta mind.
recurseP 26d ago
The point is: which brands still respect user privacy? If I were to buy a new TV today, which brands-models should I prioritize? Also, are there brands-models that in which it is possible to sideload a different OS like with mobile phones (LineageOS, GrapheneOS, etc.)
- dwedge 26d ago
  I bought a projector in part because they are behind on this and only seem to have basic software
  - msandford 26d ago
    That's a great idea, thanks for sharing!
- microtonal 26d ago
  Our Android TV (Sony) has an option to basically make it a dumb TV. Not sure whether that still exists. We use that + simply don't plug a network cable or set up WiFi. As long as they don't add cellular modems, this works.
- Cider9986 26d ago
  An Apple TV would be the best for privacy you can easily use but not perfect. Don't use streaming services. Torrenting with a VPN would share the least data but Nuvio/Stremio wouldn't share much with adtech. Can't use those on an Apple TV without sideloading :(
- toofy 26d ago
  > which brands still respect user privacy? does anyone know of a reputable site which rates companies by things such as trustworthiness? are any companies at all trustworthy anymore? like literally any?
  - HDBaseT 26d ago
    rtings is starting to cover some of this stuff now.
exe34 26d ago
Machiavelli's flexibility: evil has more options to achieve its goals than good, and therefore it always wins. (The invisible hand of the market is a myth - people don't choose things on principles unless they have money to burn).
boelboel 26d ago
The bottom of the line TVs are basically commoditized and are sold at a loss. There's few tv manufacturers and they mostly compete on price, only the top of the line models have pricing power and only for 6-24 months for new models. A supermajority of consumers don't care if they're tracked all the time and a large fraction don't mind ads everywhere either (they're used to it). A new display plant costs multiple billions.
- Cider9986 26d ago
  They would care if they understood it. They shouldn't have to care–they deserve consumer protection regardless.
  - boelboel 26d ago
    Well you can say this about dozens of products. People basically only care about price and perceived status for some products. Repairability, privacy, sustainability ... are not important for 90% of people, when government tries to they get pissed annoyed having to pay more.
    - Cider9986 26d ago
      https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/05/07/only-4-of-ios-users-in-us-are-opting-in-to-ad-tracking-report-says https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/05/07/only-4-of-ios-use...
- anon7000 26d ago
  > A new display plant costs multiple billions To be fair, most TVs on the market are buying panels from the same few manufacturers. For example, Hisense sources panels from part of LG. I think Samsung is another manufacturer. So a new company could theoretically access these panels to make a privacy friendly TV without as much capital. But like you say, it wouldn’t be able to compete on price, because the ad tech lets other companies sell at a loss.
- FireBeyond 26d ago
  > only the top of the line models have pricing power And they still do it anyway because why wouldn't they? My $4K+ TV still wants all sorts of "personalized viewing experience" access.
johnnyanmac 26d ago
We're in a recession, in all but official numbers (which are decreasingly credible by the day). Big companies weather a recession and use it to ransack countries, becsuse smaller/mid-size companies are struggling to do the bare minimum, outright shut down, or cannot start up to begin with. There's a lot of moving parts that makes it really hard for ethical newcomers to disrupt in these current times. And that's just one angle.

by Anoian 27d ago

Respect for the consumer has long been gone generally except for a few brands. I am still wondering why consumer respecting brands are not emerging more and thriving.

usern20260720 27d ago

A consumer respecting brand sells products. A Consumer selling brand sells consumers so they can be profiled, analysed for weaknesses and exploited economically in the name of Surveillance Capitalism

DarkUranium 27d ago

I suspect because it's hard to differentiate between ones that actually respect the consumer vs ones that only say so, but are actually lying to your face. That and not respecting the consumer is more profitable in the short term (only!), which means more marketing money, buying out other brands, lobbying to increase the barrier for entry, et cetera.

fithisux 27d ago

That is why politicians get rich. But also, people do not generally hesitate in front of an all-you-can-eat bouffe

ngcazz 27d ago

Because there's no incentive to do it. The consequences of being tracked are outta sight outta mind.

recurseP 26d ago

The point is: which brands still respect user privacy? If I were to buy a new TV today, which brands-models should I prioritize? Also, are there brands-models that in which it is possible to sideload a different OS like with mobile phones (LineageOS, GrapheneOS, etc.)

dwedge 26d ago
I bought a projector in part because they are behind on this and only seem to have basic software
- msandford 26d ago
  That's a great idea, thanks for sharing!
microtonal 26d ago
Our Android TV (Sony) has an option to basically make it a dumb TV. Not sure whether that still exists. We use that + simply don't plug a network cable or set up WiFi. As long as they don't add cellular modems, this works.
Cider9986 26d ago
An Apple TV would be the best for privacy you can easily use but not perfect. Don't use streaming services. Torrenting with a VPN would share the least data but Nuvio/Stremio wouldn't share much with adtech. Can't use those on an Apple TV without sideloading :(
toofy 26d ago
> which brands still respect user privacy? does anyone know of a reputable site which rates companies by things such as trustworthiness? are any companies at all trustworthy anymore? like literally any?
- HDBaseT 26d ago
  rtings is starting to cover some of this stuff now.

exe34 26d ago

Machiavelli's flexibility: evil has more options to achieve its goals than good, and therefore it always wins. (The invisible hand of the market is a myth - people don't choose things on principles unless they have money to burn).

boelboel 26d ago

The bottom of the line TVs are basically commoditized and are sold at a loss. There's few tv manufacturers and they mostly compete on price, only the top of the line models have pricing power and only for 6-24 months for new models. A supermajority of consumers don't care if they're tracked all the time and a large fraction don't mind ads everywhere either (they're used to it). A new display plant costs multiple billions.

Cider9986 26d ago
They would care if they understood it. They shouldn't have to care–they deserve consumer protection regardless.
- boelboel 26d ago
  Well you can say this about dozens of products. People basically only care about price and perceived status for some products. Repairability, privacy, sustainability ... are not important for 90% of people, when government tries to they get pissed annoyed having to pay more.
  - Cider9986 26d ago
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/05/07/only-4-of-ios-users-in-us-are-opting-in-to-ad-tracking-report-says https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/05/07/only-4-of-ios-use...
anon7000 26d ago
> A new display plant costs multiple billions To be fair, most TVs on the market are buying panels from the same few manufacturers. For example, Hisense sources panels from part of LG. I think Samsung is another manufacturer. So a new company could theoretically access these panels to make a privacy friendly TV without as much capital. But like you say, it wouldn’t be able to compete on price, because the ad tech lets other companies sell at a loss.
FireBeyond 26d ago
> only the top of the line models have pricing power And they still do it anyway because why wouldn't they? My $4K+ TV still wants all sorts of "personalized viewing experience" access.

johnnyanmac 26d ago

We're in a recession, in all but official numbers (which are decreasingly credible by the day). Big companies weather a recession and use it to ransack countries, becsuse smaller/mid-size companies are struggling to do the bare minimum, outright shut down, or cannot start up to begin with. There's a lot of moving parts that makes it really hard for ethical newcomers to disrupt in these current times. And that's just one angle.