4 ms·

Did you catch the part where A/I Collective is operated by foreign parties outside the US?

• Arainach 29d ago
  If you believe in civil liberties as rights and ideals, your belief shouldn't stop at borders.
  • politician 29d ago
    [flagged]
    • vrganj 29d ago
      Do you think your country is the only one that thought of free speech? Your particular implementation is irrelevant, I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve by giving us a lecture on how some foreign country justifies their self-perception. That being said, it is somewhat humorous how you're confirming the stereotypes that apparently even that needs guns and violence over there somehow?
      • politician 29d ago
        [flagged]
        • Arainach 29d ago
          > Hmm, I would have expected more outrage from the US "free speech absolutists" over this US government decision The crowd that claims to be in favor of free speech should be in favor of free speech for everyone, not just US citizens. This thread isn't about the government - it's about how HN's very vocal "free speech" crowd are actually libertarians who want to say awful things and not get called out rather than people who stand up for the concept of free speech in general.
          • politician 29d ago
            Why is my position invalid? I'm in favor of the exact type of free speech provided by the Bill of Rights for citizens of the USA, of which I am one, and that I do not care about the fantastical universal "for everyone" form of free speech that is being pushed on HN? Let your own countries defend their own "free speech" rights. The UN cannot defend it for you, and you cannot defend it for yourself.
            • mitxela 29d ago
              So you only care about things that benefit you?
            • vrganj 29d ago
              So basically your position is imperialism mixed with some weird provincial fetishization of some document, not being pro free speech? And you wonder why people consider that both ugly and simultaneously ridiculous?
    • lokar 29d ago
      The Declaration of Independence, constitution and bill of rights aim to recognize and protect rights everyone is born with.
  • xienze 29d ago
    Good point, we should also allow foreign organizations to contribute to US election campaigns and make Facebook ads because they might also believe in civil liberties as rights and ideals, uh... right?
    • mitxela 29d ago
      [dead]
    • Arainach 29d ago
      Money isn't speech.
      • x-complexity 29d ago
        As you said yourself: > > If you believe in civil liberties as rights and ideals, your belief shouldn't stop at borders. If you believe in civil liberties as rights and ideals, your belief shouldn't stop at money. Either the right extends everywhere, including money, or it doesn't.
        • Arainach 29d ago
          That doesn't follow. It's OK to say you wish a politician was dead. It's not OK to pay someone to kill them. It's OK to say that you support some criminal activity (let's say Luigi), but it's not OK to offer direct financial support for their crimes.
          • x-complexity 29d ago
            > It's OK to say you wish a politician was dead. It's not OK to pay someone to kill them. Both actions are equivalent, as such words are (social and/or political) capital bounties offered to the masses in return for fulfilling the death of said politician. Capital always exists, even in the form of words. To deny a variant of capital whilst allowing another variant is inconsistent/doublespeak. Just because it's not printed onto a piece of denominated paper, doesn't mean that such capital doesn't exist.
• flohofwoe 29d ago
  Funny, the same US "free speech absolutists" get upset about "censorship" outside the US (mostly in EU countries) all the time, so it would be completely on point.
  • Petersipoi 29d ago
    I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. You seem to be saying the "free speech absolutists" getting upset about censorship in the EU is a bad thing. While, at the same time, saying them not getting upset about this is a bad thing. In criticizing their inconsistencies, you are highlighting and simultaneously missing your own inconsistencies.
    • rexpop 29d ago
      This is not how accusations of hypocrisy work. I don't have to agree with any particular stance of yours in order to accuse you of hypocrisy.
  • mitxela 29d ago
    [dead]
  • mitxela 29d ago
    No E.U. censorship happened here and they're still legally allowed to operate in Italy. In the past they've been attacked by Italy several times and always won. This is a pure US threat against a pure European entity. It's like if France thought it could shut down Samsung - and then Samsung quit operating.
• kennywinker 29d ago
  So free speech absolutists don't care about free speech, just free speech for americans on american soil? Not very absolutist then...
  • estearum 29d ago
    "Free speech absolutists" demonstrably don't even care about free speech for Americans on American soil. "Free speech absolutism" is, in 99.9999% of cases, a euphemism for 1) holding abhorrent views and 2) being a gigantic fucking crybaby when someone criticizes you for them.
• overfeed 29d ago
  The US free speech advocates had plenty to day about Julian Assange, an Australian stuck in the Ecuadorean embassy all the way across the Atlantic.