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Europe is decoupling itself all ready also. Using SEPA-Inst and wero.

swiftcoder 26d ago
Unfortunately decoupling payments within the EU is insufficient if the US can just threaten to sanction your bank, and in doing so force the bank to drop you as a customer. Even in the presence of an internal European payments network, those banks still need to transact with the US and other US-sphere countries...
- toomuchtodo 26d ago
  For now, but not forever. Skate to where the puck is going to be. Decoupling continues, with the target being independence. Quote this comment five years from now.
  - riffraff 26d ago
    Not forever but long enough: there's no foreseeable future where the USA becomes an economy small enough to not be worth trading in. For most banks the ability to sell financial instruments which end up interacting with the US financial institutions is fundamental.
    - deleted 26d ago
      [deleted]
- mahkeiro 26d ago
  No but then you can have local bank that will not have US interactions but can still serve you. Since the French judge of the IPC was sanctioned, it’s clear that the EU must completely decouple from the US.
- mitxela 26d ago
  [dead]
- Gigachad 26d ago
  The more times the US uses this as a weapon, the less power it holds and the more effort other countries go through to decouple.
- mitxela 26d ago
  The payment system has to be decoupled first, and then banks can have nothing to fear from US sanctions.
  - swiftcoder 26d ago
    > The payment system has to be decoupled first, and then banks can have nothing to fear from US sanctions. I'm not sure the payment system is most banks primary concern. Being able to buy/sell US securities turns out to be a fairly fundamental part of the modern economy
    - mitxela 25d ago
      Any EU back that's holding US securities deserves to fail. And then have its leader get jailed.
david_draco 26d ago
The US pressured Europe last time, in 2019, into aligning with their sanctions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_in_Support_of_Trade_Exchanges https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_in_Support_of_Trade... The Iran situation could have gone better if trade and JCPOA nuclear oversight had continued.
deleted 26d ago
[deleted]

Unfortunately decoupling payments within the EU is insufficient if the US can just threaten to sanction your bank, and in doing so force the bank to drop you as a customer. Even in the presence of an internal European payments network, those banks still need to transact with the US and other US-sphere countries...

toomuchtodo 26d ago
For now, but not forever. Skate to where the puck is going to be. Decoupling continues, with the target being independence. Quote this comment five years from now.
- riffraff 26d ago
  Not forever but long enough: there's no foreseeable future where the USA becomes an economy small enough to not be worth trading in. For most banks the ability to sell financial instruments which end up interacting with the US financial institutions is fundamental.
  - deleted 26d ago
    [deleted]
mahkeiro 26d ago
No but then you can have local bank that will not have US interactions but can still serve you. Since the French judge of the IPC was sanctioned, it’s clear that the EU must completely decouple from the US.
mitxela 26d ago
[dead]
Gigachad 26d ago
The more times the US uses this as a weapon, the less power it holds and the more effort other countries go through to decouple.
mitxela 26d ago
The payment system has to be decoupled first, and then banks can have nothing to fear from US sanctions.
- swiftcoder 26d ago
  > The payment system has to be decoupled first, and then banks can have nothing to fear from US sanctions. I'm not sure the payment system is most banks primary concern. Being able to buy/sell US securities turns out to be a fairly fundamental part of the modern economy
  - mitxela 25d ago
    Any EU back that's holding US securities deserves to fail. And then have its leader get jailed.

david_draco 26d ago

The US pressured Europe last time, in 2019, into aligning with their sanctions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_in_Support_of_Trade_Exchanges https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_in_Support_of_Trade... The Iran situation could have gone better if trade and JCPOA nuclear oversight had continued.

deleted 26d ago

[deleted]