3 ms·

Just beware that an awful lot of "silicone" cabling coming from China is actually overplasticized PVC, particular cabling used in instrument probes. It feels li

Just beware that an awful lot of "silicone" cabling coming from China is actually overplasticized PVC, particular cabling used in instrument probes. It feels like silicone until it starts getting stiff while at the same time outgassing plasticizer like crazy, or you touch it with a soldering iron or similar. I would expect most or even all of the cat-ran-across-the-keyboard Amazon brands to be overplasticized PVC, not silicone (hint: Use the Knockoff plugin for Chromefox, https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff, which will warn you for stuff that's sold on Temu West, aka.Amazon, it's warning on almost all of the pseudo-brands listed in the article). I've also run into way too much cabling that's CCA or even CCS. Garbage on the outside, garbage on the inside.

hilbert42 1mo ago
"…actually overplasticized PVC," Despite the point in my comment about power cable extensions coverings becoming hard through the lack of plasticizers, I confirm your point about overplasticized PVC in instrument cables. I have a lot of instrument leads that I thought were silicone only to find that after a year or so they've gone hard. So much so that new unpacked ones can no longer be easily straightened (the kinks remain unless one heats the cable up and then straightens them). Despite availability issues,the problem is trying to determine what's real silicone and what's not.
- ssl-3 1mo ago
  I used to buy vulcanized rubber (like SO cable) test leads from Oldaker Manufacturing in Dunkirk, Ohio. They had supplied them to Tripplett when the latter was still manufacturing meters in Bluffton, Ohio. The ones I've had for decades are still working well; they're reliable and flexible. I learned about the utility of rubber after becoming frustrated with PVC leads being stiff in cold weather. I stepped into Oldaker's shop on the way home one day and asked the nice older lady there about buying some silicone leads. "Are you sure you want silicone," she asked. "Most people want rubber." I was sure that she was nuts and that I knew exactly what I wanted, but I played along. She disappeared and came back a moment later with two sets of test leads: One with silicone insulation, and the other with rubber insulation. I examined them both. I picked the rubber ones; they somehow seemed both tougher and more flexible. No regrets. I've bought more examples over the years for different things. (Perhaps it'd have been smart to have also bought some silicone leads from them as well, for long-term comparison. Alas.) --- Anyway, Oldaker Manufacturing burned to the ground about 10 years ago. Whatever tooling and supplies remained after Tripplett packed up and left is simply gone. Which is a bummer for a couple of reasons: First, they seemed like very nice people who were just trying to get by after their heyday was over. It was very much a mom-and-pop facility by the time I came 'round. Second, I subsequently cannot find any reliable source of rubber-insulated test leads. It's only been a decade so far, and I do look occasionally. They do not appear to exist. (There's probably be an opportunity here for someone to make test leads using vulcanized rubber and sell them, but it's limited. If it works and becomes popular, then someone overseas will clone it. And when they clone it, then others will follow with their own take. After that, it's just a hop skip and a jump before we reach the end game: Dilution. Wherein: Overplasticized PVC test leads that are described as being rubber will be easy to find, and actually-rubber leads will be impossible to locate in the sea of noise.)
  - hilbert42 1mo ago
    "I picked the rubber ones; they somehow seemed both tougher and more flexible. No regrets. I've bought more examples over the years…" Right, depends on the quality of the rubber I suppose. I've been suspicious of rubber because when it's old it often turns into a gooey mess or goes hard and cracks (as with VR [vulcanized rubber] used in house wiring in the days before PVC — and often a cause of fires. At the moment that's a bit close to home. I'm in Australia where power is 240V and only two days ago I needed to test an old Advantest spectrum analyzer and I wasn't sure if it had been strapped for 240 or 110V but didn't have a 240/110V transformer to hand so I dug out an ancient variac/auto-transformer to do the job and its power lead was vulcanized rubber which had turned into a sticky mush (replacing the lead didn't help as the windings had a short to the laminations). Similarly, the rubber insulation on my super flexible AVO multimeter leads with many, many strands of superfine Cu wire has disintegrated. It's similarly perished (but they're well over 30 years old). My first experience of silicone comes from its use as the outer jacket/insulation in microphone cables used in an industrial environment (TV studio). It was wonderful, cables were super easy to roll up and keep orderly, and despite its so-called reputation for not being rugged enough heavy camera dollies would regularly run over it without damage. These cables would last for years (the only occasional issue with them was when an XLR connector would get ripped off when caught on something and someone pulled super hard to free it). I've no issue with using VR for leads except I've not been able to get it (for example, I can no longer get a replacement for my AVO leads).
kevin_thibedeau 1mo ago
You used to be able to buy silicone extension cords. Now it's all the new low temp plasticized PVC.
atombender 1mo ago
Is there a way to test a cable to see if it's PVC and not silicone?
- unrented7977 1mo ago
  Heat. PVC melts, silicone burns.
mschuster91 1mo ago
> hint: Use the Knockoff plugin for Chromefox, https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff le me: see README, spot slop tells, scroll to the files, see CLAUDE.md Yeah I'd love to see a stopslop extension for Github, warning me if the usual suspects of slop bullshit are present.
- cromka 1mo ago
  WHAT
- yjftsjthsd-h 1mo ago
  Okay. Is it inaccurate? Buggy? Defective or deficient in any material way?
  - mschuster91 1mo ago
    I consider any form of AI generated stuff a waste of my time. I do not wish to interact with LLM generated content more than absolutely necessary and I loathe being surprised with uncanny valley "tells".
  - pseudohadamard 1mo ago
    It does the job. I couldn't care if it was written by chickens pecking on a keyboard, as long as it works.
CGMthrowaway 1mo ago
And the plasticizers (DEHP primarily) are really nasty, easily slough off onto your skin where they are absorbed. Don't ever put plastic cable in your mouth, or that of a child
fcjr 1mo ago
100%, this is unfortunately what I've found, the vast majority of cables I've purchased so far are not genuine silicone

hilbert42 1mo ago

"…actually overplasticized PVC," Despite the point in my comment about power cable extensions coverings becoming hard through the lack of plasticizers, I confirm your point about overplasticized PVC in instrument cables. I have a lot of instrument leads that I thought were silicone only to find that after a year or so they've gone hard. So much so that new unpacked ones can no longer be easily straightened (the kinks remain unless one heats the cable up and then straightens them). Despite availability issues,the problem is trying to determine what's real silicone and what's not.

ssl-3 1mo ago
I used to buy vulcanized rubber (like SO cable) test leads from Oldaker Manufacturing in Dunkirk, Ohio. They had supplied them to Tripplett when the latter was still manufacturing meters in Bluffton, Ohio. The ones I've had for decades are still working well; they're reliable and flexible. I learned about the utility of rubber after becoming frustrated with PVC leads being stiff in cold weather. I stepped into Oldaker's shop on the way home one day and asked the nice older lady there about buying some silicone leads. "Are you sure you want silicone," she asked. "Most people want rubber." I was sure that she was nuts and that I knew exactly what I wanted, but I played along. She disappeared and came back a moment later with two sets of test leads: One with silicone insulation, and the other with rubber insulation. I examined them both. I picked the rubber ones; they somehow seemed both tougher and more flexible. No regrets. I've bought more examples over the years for different things. (Perhaps it'd have been smart to have also bought some silicone leads from them as well, for long-term comparison. Alas.) --- Anyway, Oldaker Manufacturing burned to the ground about 10 years ago. Whatever tooling and supplies remained after Tripplett packed up and left is simply gone. Which is a bummer for a couple of reasons: First, they seemed like very nice people who were just trying to get by after their heyday was over. It was very much a mom-and-pop facility by the time I came 'round. Second, I subsequently cannot find any reliable source of rubber-insulated test leads. It's only been a decade so far, and I do look occasionally. They do not appear to exist. (There's probably be an opportunity here for someone to make test leads using vulcanized rubber and sell them, but it's limited. If it works and becomes popular, then someone overseas will clone it. And when they clone it, then others will follow with their own take. After that, it's just a hop skip and a jump before we reach the end game: Dilution. Wherein: Overplasticized PVC test leads that are described as being rubber will be easy to find, and actually-rubber leads will be impossible to locate in the sea of noise.)
- hilbert42 1mo ago
  "I picked the rubber ones; they somehow seemed both tougher and more flexible. No regrets. I've bought more examples over the years…" Right, depends on the quality of the rubber I suppose. I've been suspicious of rubber because when it's old it often turns into a gooey mess or goes hard and cracks (as with VR [vulcanized rubber] used in house wiring in the days before PVC — and often a cause of fires. At the moment that's a bit close to home. I'm in Australia where power is 240V and only two days ago I needed to test an old Advantest spectrum analyzer and I wasn't sure if it had been strapped for 240 or 110V but didn't have a 240/110V transformer to hand so I dug out an ancient variac/auto-transformer to do the job and its power lead was vulcanized rubber which had turned into a sticky mush (replacing the lead didn't help as the windings had a short to the laminations). Similarly, the rubber insulation on my super flexible AVO multimeter leads with many, many strands of superfine Cu wire has disintegrated. It's similarly perished (but they're well over 30 years old). My first experience of silicone comes from its use as the outer jacket/insulation in microphone cables used in an industrial environment (TV studio). It was wonderful, cables were super easy to roll up and keep orderly, and despite its so-called reputation for not being rugged enough heavy camera dollies would regularly run over it without damage. These cables would last for years (the only occasional issue with them was when an XLR connector would get ripped off when caught on something and someone pulled super hard to free it). I've no issue with using VR for leads except I've not been able to get it (for example, I can no longer get a replacement for my AVO leads).

kevin_thibedeau 1mo ago

You used to be able to buy silicone extension cords. Now it's all the new low temp plasticized PVC.

atombender 1mo ago

Is there a way to test a cable to see if it's PVC and not silicone?

unrented7977 1mo ago
Heat. PVC melts, silicone burns.

mschuster91 1mo ago

> hint: Use the Knockoff plugin for Chromefox, https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff https://github.com/Shpigford/knockoff le me: see README, spot slop tells, scroll to the files, see CLAUDE.md Yeah I'd love to see a stopslop extension for Github, warning me if the usual suspects of slop bullshit are present.

cromka 1mo ago
WHAT
yjftsjthsd-h 1mo ago
Okay. Is it inaccurate? Buggy? Defective or deficient in any material way?
- mschuster91 1mo ago
  I consider any form of AI generated stuff a waste of my time. I do not wish to interact with LLM generated content more than absolutely necessary and I loathe being surprised with uncanny valley "tells".
- pseudohadamard 1mo ago
  It does the job. I couldn't care if it was written by chickens pecking on a keyboard, as long as it works.

CGMthrowaway 1mo ago

And the plasticizers (DEHP primarily) are really nasty, easily slough off onto your skin where they are absorbed. Don't ever put plastic cable in your mouth, or that of a child

fcjr 1mo ago

100%, this is unfortunately what I've found, the vast majority of cables I've purchased so far are not genuine silicone